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Topic Subject:Faction Discussion - Philistines
SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 11 September 2008 13:42 EDT (US)         


The Philistines represent the dominant force of Canaan, men from across the sea with great wealth, superior technology, and a hatred of the less docile Semitic tribes.

PRE-IRON :
These are a coastal people, moving strong armies here and there on a whim, crushing resistance before it can organize.

A raiding army composed primarily of armored infantry, some missile-chariots, and small numbers of greeklike guards.


Possible units include Philistine Spearmen, Light Chariots, Dendra Spearmen, and iron-shield infantry (still pre-iron).


Still thinking :
  • Coastal Raiders - Kilted, short sword, round shield. Strong as militia go but expensive too with penalties in mountains.
  • Philistine Spearmen - Kilted, leather armor, spear, round shield,better than average line infantry.
  • Seafarers - Armored archers with decent swordsmanship but penalties in mountains.
  • Armored Swordsmen - Exactly that with round shields.
  • Dendra Spearbearers - Dendra armored spearmen with long, two-handed spears.
  • Dendra Shieldbearers - Denra armored swordsmen with tall shields, they lack the mobility and chariot-killing power of the spearbearers but are virtually unconquerable by all but the most fierce or numerous enemy.
  • Canaanite Chariots - Light javelin/spear chariots with little speed or charge power but good fire support. They are not the dominant force on the field like other chariots will be but are more than capable of softening up light infantry or chasing off missile troops.
  • Noble Consort - Unlike the leaders of other nations, the Philistines are guided largely by personal interest. Their soldiers fight not because they are forced to, but for the promise of loot and land. The guard of a general therefor is little more than a ring of spectators, often not even participating.

    Later units will reflect a tendency towards land armies and away from the coast, with good scale armor and larger, more mobile forces.

    More to come.

    [This message has been edited by SrJamesTyrrel (edited 09-15-2008 @ 02:09 AM).]

  • AuthorReplies:
    SrJamesTyrrel
    Legionary
    posted 15 September 2008 01:44 EDT (US)     1 / 5       
    Here is the concept art (shamelessly traced, which i never do but did now for speed) for the Seafarers unit.



    Sea-People (minoan hat) Philistines (red plume cap)

    the idea is that he is either an archer with melee equipment or a swordsman with ranged equipment, neither excelling at nor shaming either trade. This would reflect his true nature - to fight aboard ships where bows would be needed as they closed, swords as the boarded. Because the shield is quite large, it cannot be used with the bow, so i would think that it would be on his back when shooting and on his hand when fighting (easily done in the .cas) and counted as armor rather than a shield.


    Thoughts?

    [This message has been edited by SrJamesTyrrel (edited 09-15-2008 @ 02:06 AM).]

    Andalus
    Legionary
    posted 15 September 2008 08:05 EDT (US)     2 / 5       
    I like the concept for the Seafarers. That would work well as a general model for Philistine units.
    so i would think that it would be on his back when shooting and on his hand when fighting (easily done in the .cas)
    So why the hell didn't they do that in BI? CA are lazy.

    Are Seafarers meant to be a normal unit or a supplementary one? As in, are they Arcani with bows, or an actual battle line unit?
    Later units will reflect a tendency towards land armies and away from the coast, with good scale armor and larger, more mobile forces.
    I presume these are the changes that will take place post-iron since the Philistines already have it?
    SrJamesTyrrel
    Legionary
    posted 15 September 2008 09:09 EDT (US)     3 / 5       
    i was assuming that these guys would be a fairly common unit in the first time period, but because they are not particularly good they could fall out of favor when the army becomes less greek and more levantine (adding to the ranks heavy archers and maybe slingers for missiles and better infantry).

    unlike vanilla, i would prefer the age change not to remove all old units from the roster, but rather leave a few interesting ones. The philistines are not the philistines if they don't have any coastal raiders, for instance, nor are the hebrews hebrews if they can't have shepherds.

    one way i thought the coastal raiders and seafarers could be kept in the game is producing them from ports rather than archery ranges and barracks. this would mean that they could be "delivered" to any town with a coastline (without building significant structures), but not be trained where there are none. By making them not so inferior to the new missile units, the player would like keeping them around a bit.
    SubRosa
    Legionary
    posted 15 September 2008 12:14 EDT (US)     4 / 5       
    so i would think that it would be on his back when shooting and on his hand when fighting (easily done in the .cas)
    How do you do that? I imagine you would make two shields, one attached to the back and the other to the left hand. But how do you make one appear and the other disappear in concert with the weapon changing from primary to secondary?
    SrJamesTyrrel
    Legionary
    posted 15 September 2008 13:48 EDT (US)     5 / 5       
    by attaching them to the primary and secondary weapons such that each is a single entity comprised of a weapon and a shield .

    I haven't tried this with a shield yet but i have tried it with a sword (appearing in the scabbard when not in use, appearing in the hand when it is)

    Because it's slightly awkward like any weapon change, I suspect that they avoided it in BI and RTW because it was considered too drastic a change for something that would have no gameplay value. We can do it because we don't have superiors, deadlines, conventions...and because generally we think that sort of extra visual thing is neat.

    [This message has been edited by SrJamesTyrrel (edited 09-15-2008 @ 01:58 PM).]

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