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Total War Heaven » Forums » RTW Guides and Articles Forum » Macedon in Multiplayer-2015
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Topic Subject:Macedon in Multiplayer-2015
KimJongLi
Legionary
posted 30 September 2015 22:08 EDT (US)         
"There is nothing impossible to him who will try." - Alexander the Great

The Macedon faction, made famous by its late leader, Alexander the Great and made popular by the Youtuber "Prince of Macedon", is a popular faction and is one of the most common factions in the multiplayer lobby. However, I see many people not using Macedon to its full effect, perhaps due to gripes with so called "historical accuracy". Your opponent does not care about such things, and neither do I.

Before continuing on, I would highly recommend you read my basic multiplayer guide here: *INSERT NOOB GUIDE LINK HERE*

A Bit About Macedon, as a Faction in the Game:

Macedon is certainly one of the more 'balanced' factions. It is not among the best, but is always a solid choice and always has a way to win. It has decent everything, from decent Infantry to decent archers to decent cavalry. It does not excel at anything. But as a result, it can utilise very flexible army builds, which can be used to surprise opponents or in some rare cases, completely counter them.

Advantages of Macedon:

Macedon has at least 1 area of absolute advantage compared to any other faction. (e.g. Against Egypt it has better infantry, it has better archers and infantry against Armenia, better archers than Rome, etc.) In some cases, it has the advantage in all 3 major areas. Infantry, missiles and cavalry.

Macedon's cavalry is one of its stronger points. Companion cavalry is excellent with its high charge bonus, and its Macedonian cavalry means its heavy cavalry roster circumvents cwb's "max 6 same" rule. It is also the only faction with the light lancers unit, which makes even its light cavalry quite threatening if used properly. Its combination of both regular archers and Cretan archers means that it is more than capable of winning the usual missile fight and its royal pikemen are not too shabby either, boasting the best statistics of any long pike unit in the game, as well as more units (150% more than a regular sized unit) for the money. All of Macedon's units are well priced and not too expensive, allowing it to create generally very cost efficient armies.

Disadvantages of Macedon:

It is an average faction. Other than against some weak barbarian factions+Numidia, Macedon will not have any guaranteed/auto wins against any other factions. It is a pike faction, which means that its infantry is slightly more micro heavy. Also, although Macedon always has a chance at winning, it is not always a good chance. Its units, although solid, are not spectacular, and so will usually require the user to be reasonably skilled. Its infantry is generally less well armoured than Roman or Greek heavy infantry, which makes them slightly more vulnerable to missile fire.

How Macedon is often played:

In Low Denarii Games (10k-20k):

Macedon is a good skirmish faction in low denarii games, but is also capable of more defensive strategies. Its Cretan archers, regular archers, companion cavalry, Macedonian cavalry, superb light cavalry and excellent long pikes allow it to be a force to be reckoned with- in the right hands.

To skirmish, you will want at least 6 gold/gold (gold attack and gold defence upgraded) archers and at least 6 gold/gold companion cavalry. The rest are flex slots you can use to suit the opponent you are facing. (e.g. if you are facing Rome, you want the cavalry edge, grab some Macedonian cavalry or light lancers, etc.) A more defensive strategy would be to bring 6 royal pikes, 6 gold/gold archers and a mix of heavy and light cavalry (gold/gold of course). Your micro will have to be at least at a decent level to make either of these work to a good standard, which is why I do not highly recommend this faction to new players. Running away and counterattacking at the same time or protecting your archers against light cavalry swarms is not the easiest thing to do, and it is often very micro intensive. Learning how to quickly lift and lower the pikes to be able to use them as a mobile screen is extremely important for this strategy to work. Use the hotkey 'F' to toggle the phalanx ability helps with this.

However, if the map is not flat, consider bringing a decent sized force of gold/gold royal pikemen and/or archers. Taking hills is of paramount importance, and you will not be able to force your opponent off a hill by charging uphill with cavalry. Superior infantry or missiles is the only reliable way to do this, and if you do not get the terrain advantage early on, you will have a hard time catching up.

A very skirmish oriented Macedonian army under CWB rules. This will struggle against chariots, but will do well against non-chariot factions.
In Mid-High Denarii Games (25k-60k):

High denarii games are much more simple, but arguably more difficult due to Macedon's mediocre infantry. Your royal pikes will make up your main force, so bring as many of those as you feel necessary. However, do not forget the "at least 4 gold/gold cavalry" rule (but only within the 10k-40k range). Make sure that you do not isolate your units and counter your opponent appropriately when he enters your space. Again, on non flat maps, take hills before your opponent does or you will have trouble trying to force him off. Running the pikes out of phalanx formation is also very critical here.

You want to play aggressively with the advantages you have, or more often for Macedon, the advantages you find yourself having. For example, if you have better archers, protect them until your infantry is engaged, then bring them out to the flanks and shoot the backs/flanks. It always helps to have better cavalry and archers than your opponent, as archers cannot be protected effectively without cavalry. If you have stronger/more infantry, engage the opponent's infantry and grind them out with the infantry fight, using the long pikes to your advantage while taking care of the flanks and back with your cavalry. Strong cavalry is always good, getting a large cavalry supremacy often wins games outright, so isolating your opponent's cavalry force and just blocking off infantry from helping in the cavalry engagement is often a good idea if you have the clear cavalry edge.

A 30K Macedonian army. Heavy infantry makes it great for taking important terrain positions.

Dislodging the opposition from the hill with superior infantry.

With the best long pikes in the game, Macedon is very difficult to dislodge from key positions.

[This message has been edited by KimJongLi (edited 10-25-2015 @ 06:10 AM).]

AuthorReplies:
Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 03 October 2015 13:27 EDT (US)     1 / 19       
I finally got around to reading this- life is busy at the moment.

A few tips:
You talk a lot about Cheezewhiz in the opening paragraphs. Don't. It is considered rude to 'bash' other contributers. You may mention the differences, but don't critique past strategies as 'poorly thought out'. That makes you come across as arrogant, which will put your tale in poor light.

I would mention that Macedon was made famous by Alexander, and popular by Prince fo Macedon. You wrote it the other way around. That works, but I feel this might work better- Macedon had first to exist and be famous before it could become popular. A timing thing.

You might want to mention Light Lancers- if you cycle charge them, they get their massive charge bonus and do not stand around to die like flies in the ensuing melee, making them wonderfully cheap killers.

Size your pics to a max width of 700 pixels- that makes it fit the page better.

This is quite good overall. Well done. Now tweak it to make it exellent!

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Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII
KimJongLi
Legionary
posted 03 October 2015 16:38 EDT (US)     2 / 19       
ok this was the warm up though, the main event is the one before this one. I feel for your busy life Bashing removed from this one and pictures all downsized! (finally figured out how to do that!)

[This message has been edited by KimJongLi (edited 10-03-2015 @ 11:41 PM).]

Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 04 October 2015 05:08 EDT (US)     3 / 19       


Nits:

About Macedon as a Game faction:
My thoughts: I agree that Macedon does not excel in any one branch, but it is optimized for hammer and anvil tactics. Pikemen make excellent anvils, and the large selection of cavalry- even the cheapie stuff- makes for a powerful hammer.

from decent Infantry and decent archers do decent cavalry
from decent Infantry to decent archers to decent cavalry

Advantages of Macedon:
Here you completely disagree with what you just wrote about the Macedonians not excelling in any one branch.

Disadvantages of Macedon:
In Single player, the major disadvantage of Macedon is its location- between the Greeks and near the Brutii, who come calling rather quickly. Plus the Plague hits early on. A Macedonian player must move quick.

In Multiplayer, those drawbacks have little to do with gameplayer. Any faction in the hands of a good player utilitizing its strrengths against the opponent's weaknesses and preventing him/her from doing the same will win. Macedon's drawbacks in Multiplayer might be price of units, armor value of units (sarissas mean pikement are less armored, and thus vulnerable to arrows), and the slow speed of the advancing phalanxes.

A Macedonian player will be required to move quickly- usually with cavalry. If you are a poor cavalry general, stay away from Macedon.


Army set up:

Overall Good. Could be a bit more detailed- explain the units chosen and why. You do well saying choose at least 4 gold/gold cavalry, but not saying why. Ask yourself the "why" at every piece of advice, and ensure the answer to that is written for the reader.

Tactics:
Little mentioned, but noted above. You might want to give advice what these armies are best suited for- attack, defense, maneuver battle, attrition battle, etc. Do not be afraid to go in depth.

Macedon is great for fluid, rapidly-moving battles- being a heavy cavalry dominated faction. Cavalry equals movement- the arm of decision. You do well mentioning slaughtering the enemy cavalry first, but then?

I really like this review so far. Please continue!

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Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII
KimJongLi
Legionary
posted 04 October 2015 06:00 EDT (US)     4 / 19       
First of all, thanks a bunch for reading and the grammar checkup!

Points on Macedon as a game faction:
Your point on hammer and anvil strikes applies to all factions. It is not unique to Macedon. There are no factions where this tactic is not effective.

In defence of how I wrote the advantages section:
I do not see how I disagree with what I wrote in the first section. I claim that Macedon does not excel at anything, which means it does not perform exceptionally in any area. This is true. It does not have the best archers, cavalry or infantry. Absolute advantage is something it does better than another faction. For example, although Egypt has better cavalry and archers, Macedon has the absolute advantage in infantry, since its royal pikes are better than the Pharaoh's guards.

Disadvantages:
This guide is about multiplayer. You will always be right to me when talking about the singleplayer aspect.

However, I disagree with your reasoning for the multiplayer. The unit rosters of the different factions do make certain factions dominant over others. For an extreme example, gaul will not beat Egypt in a low denarii cwb 99% of the time. Egypt has chariots>cav/light inf and pikeless infantry, Pharoh's bowmen>foresters, pikes>nude/pikeless barbarians (absolute advantage in all 3 areas and then some). Short of the Egyptian player charging his entire force uphill into prepared gaulish hoards, and even then, the gauls will most likely not win. If you put two players of equal skill on this matchup, 100% egypt will win. I could go on.

Macedon's drawbacks do not include the speed of its phalanx units. I assure you they run just as fast as urbans with their pikes lifted. I have noted that it is a more micro heavy faction than some. Its units are very well priced, I do not think they are too expensive. But yes, they are more vulnerable to arrows, so I will include that.

Macedon has the game's most powerful long pikes. That in itself counts for something. It is excellent for countering chariots and normal length pike factions. Also makes it easier to catch cavalry. Its infantry is not the best, but certainly strong. I have seen many infantry heavy Macedonian armies work, grinding down even spartans with their long pikes before they can be touched.

If Macedon is a cavalry dominated faction, then what does that make Pontus, Parthia, Seleucid Empire, Scythia, Armenia and Egypt? :P Sure, its cavalry is strong, but it does not dominate the faction. It has decent, above average infantry.

Army set up and tactics:
http://rtw.heavengames.com/cgi-bin/forums/display.cgi?action=ct&f=40,8628,,365
I wanted to try getting this through first because a lot of what I say in future will be based on this. Would be great if you could read this! Take your time

[This message has been edited by KimJongLi (edited 10-04-2015 @ 06:18 AM).]

Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 05 October 2015 03:03 EDT (US)     5 / 19       
Your reasoning is good, and mine quite tainted from Single Player.

Pike men can run with pikes lifted- explain to the noob that you can make them run by taking them out of phalanx (select and hit F key). Remember to put them back in phalanx after setting them in positon (F again).

The length of the Pikes- mention that! (more than simply in passing) and prefereably explain why that is a good thing.

From Kim:
It has decent everything, from decent Infantry to decent archers to decent cavalry. It does not excel at anything.

Macedon has at least 1 area of absolute advantage over any other faction. In some cases, it has absolute advantage in all 3 major areas.


The confusion arises from the phrase "Absolute advantage". That makes it seem that they do excel at something. Maybe you could clarify that paradox with something like "While Macedon does not excel in any one branch, it does possess some important advantages in at least one branch, sometimes all three." Then go on to explain what those advantages are.

You might want to explain what gold/gold means. I know you mean upgrade weapons and armor to gold, but new players might miss that. Explain it once early on, then you can leave the rest as is.

I am liking this very much! Damned fine work, Kim!

|||||||||||||||| A transplanted Viking, born a millennium too late. |||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Too many Awards to list in Signature, sorry lords...|||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Listed on my page for your convenience and envy.|||||||||||||||||
Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII
KimJongLi
Legionary
posted 05 October 2015 04:32 EDT (US)     6 / 19       
Thanks again! I think I have made the necessary corrections. I was wondering if I could link my basic guide to this one? and probably also any MP guides I write in the future since otherwise i would take up a lot of space for rewriting.
Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 05 October 2015 11:50 EDT (US)     7 / 19       
Sure.
Just put in a "LINK TO TOTAL NOOB GUIDE" where you want the link to be.
Once they are both posted, remind me about it (old people can be so forgetful...)
And I will change those words to the actual link using my super seraphy powers.

|||||||||||||||| A transplanted Viking, born a millennium too late. |||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Too many Awards to list in Signature, sorry lords...|||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Listed on my page for your convenience and envy.|||||||||||||||||
Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII
KimJongLi
Legionary
posted 06 October 2015 03:21 EDT (US)     8 / 19       
Cheers, will do
Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 09 October 2015 00:58 EDT (US)     9 / 19       
I assume this is ready now for the Two-Day Rule invocation?

|||||||||||||||| A transplanted Viking, born a millennium too late. |||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Too many Awards to list in Signature, sorry lords...|||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Listed on my page for your convenience and envy.|||||||||||||||||
Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII
KimJongLi
Legionary
posted 09 October 2015 06:06 EDT (US)     10 / 19       
Should be ready after the basic guide goes up! Remember the link! :P

[This message has been edited by KimJongLi (edited 10-12-2015 @ 05:39 AM).]

Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 16 October 2015 09:16 EDT (US)     11 / 19       
Hei,

I got the Noob Guide posted.

I put in the link into this one and tested it- link works, but the pics on this are a hair too wide. Can you resize your uploaded pics from 640 pixels wide to 600?

Then the pics will not exceed the boundaries set by the sidebars. Article pages have a different layout than these forum pages.

Let me know when they are adjusted. This really is excellent.

|||||||||||||||| A transplanted Viking, born a millennium too late. |||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Too many Awards to list in Signature, sorry lords...|||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Listed on my page for your convenience and envy.|||||||||||||||||
Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII
KimJongLi
Legionary
posted 18 October 2015 07:17 EDT (US)     12 / 19       
The noob guide pictures were the same size though, I don't mind them crossing the margins. imgur does not let me get a much better size than the current one unfortunately.
Mons Badonicus
Legionary
posted 18 October 2015 14:52 EDT (US)     13 / 19       
Ave

I don't usually use Macedon (at all) but I think this is a great guide, made all the better with the pictures. Keep up the great work!

Papers, please.
KimJongLi
Legionary
posted 18 October 2015 15:01 EDT (US)     14 / 19       
Haha cheers
Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 05 November 2015 06:29 EDT (US)     15 / 19       
I have had intermittent Internet access lately, but have not forgotten this. I have captured the pictures and will be forcibly resizing them for your article shortly.

|||||||||||||||| A transplanted Viking, born a millennium too late. |||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Too many Awards to list in Signature, sorry lords...|||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Listed on my page for your convenience and envy.|||||||||||||||||
Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII
KimJongLi
Legionary
posted 07 November 2015 04:46 EDT (US)     16 / 19       
lol, go right ahead! I'm fine with whatever you do with the pictures as long as they don't look squashed or stretched XD
Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 08 November 2015 11:58 EDT (US)     17 / 19       
Posted and newsied.

Good job!

|||||||||||||||| A transplanted Viking, born a millennium too late. |||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Too many Awards to list in Signature, sorry lords...|||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Listed on my page for your convenience and envy.|||||||||||||||||
Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII
General Sajaru
Tribunus Laticlavius
posted 08 November 2015 20:54 EDT (US)     18 / 19       
Nice article Kim. Especially liking that last picture- makes me want to fire up Rome for a bit.

"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction." - Ronald Reagan
"Judge them not by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
"Pick up a rifle and you change instantly from a subject to a citizen." - Jeff Cooper
"I like my enemies like James Bond likes his martinis- shaken, not stirred."
My first book, The King's Own
KimJongLi
Legionary
posted 09 November 2015 01:27 EDT (US)     19 / 19       
Lol, thanks guys! Hope you do fire up Rome again
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