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Total War Heaven » Forums » Game Modification & Editor Discussion » Counsel sought on calling forth new Warriors
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Topic Subject:Counsel sought on calling forth new Warriors
Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 28 November 2007 13:12 EDT (US)         
Hail, Noble tinkerers and Genii of the Metal Box!

We are extremely regretful that we must plague thee once again, but we are at wit's end with this problem. Our best and brightest councillors have wrestled with this problem without victory, and as all mortals do, we turn to the divine for inspiration in our times of need. So please, Noble Lords, excuse our ignorance and lack of manners (for we have none!) in sending this missive to thee of the Glass Curtain in the Chamber of Peers where all our fellows may rejoice in our ignorance and lack of knowledge. We have searched and researched various means through the many portals without finding the knowledge
we so desperately seek.

Here is the problem that vexes us:

Our warhosts have recently acquired new and wondrous warriors that must be copied to the "edu" with appropriate runes added to the "eu" and the "edue". A few runes were inserted into the "dmb" and then "edb". A new tga file was inserted. This was done and lo and behold, the new warriors were ready for action. Wonderful!

Now our problem. We noticed that our warhosts were denied the use of onagers by the creators, and no warriors from the far North come flocking to the sounds of clashing swords as is there want. So, being the clever bastards that we of the Dark Forests are, we cleverly deduce that we must add these warbands to our roster by the same method as described above.

The onagers (we only use them to make sieges go faster as they are worthless in battle- our forces are joined in glorious melee far before the hurlers of rock can begin working their sorcery) have a dmb listing as barb_crew. Indeed, in that very section of the massive scroll, was a
listing for we germans. Now, all we need is a edu entry, some runic texts, and the silly edue notes. All were done upon the same pattern as those glorious warriors above.

The world refuses to open.

We remove said runes, the world opens again.

We try again with Norse Vikings, which are but berserkers who are tamer and lamer, yet can throw axes and wear armor. Their very size (a head taller than normal men) frightens men, while their fishy smell of the sea frightens horseborne. All of these were (we believe) correctly added in to the edu. The other files went okay, while we cheated when it came to model- we added a line of texture in the dmb for barb_warguard as germans, copying the texture line from gauls and substituting germans
in its place.

Yet when we try to open the world and view these warlike heathens, the world refuses to open. We then remove that entry from alone the edu and the world opens. We have also tried using the magical program named after Little
Boots (Caligula) and even resorted to changing the text runes of the original warriors who were working. Yet every attempt at changing edu results in failure and the world refuses to open. Methinks our Magic Box of Plastic and Metal has a strong dislike for things Northern, as if we
had wronged it in the past.

So, our plea. Thou art the best tinkerers of metal boxes with whom we have ever shared a discourse of battle and tactics. Thou have created many wondrous and elegant warriors and other changes to our world that work without
error and open new windows through which to view our world.

Could thee give this rough, grizzled savage counsel on how to allow these Vikings and hurlers of rock to exist in our world? Which spells must we perform over and with which potions must we anoint our Magic box with to remove this Northern curse?

Or couldst thou, oh Mighty Tinkerers and Wizards, create such runes that we may merely have our wizard paste them in the appropriate realms?

We care not for the artwork- we prefer using the Gaul Chosen Swordsmen for our Vikings as it sets them a bit apart from the rest of us, and the garlic eating Gauls are usually all dead before they can produce such swordsmen anyway, and the dmb has already a texture for barb_crew germans.

While we enjoy our sojourns beyond the Glass Curtain, we feel it would acquire a comforting Germanic flavor if we could copy the Sandal-wearer's ability to produce hurlers of rock (we cannot build the houses that make them, but we can definitely capture houses that do and force the
big-skulls inside to produce them for us) or have our Northern Brethren come and join in slaying foes.

My next task is to try to remove the silly salad-eater names the gods of war have gifted us with and replace them with true nomen from the Dark Forests, but that is a task we will attempt ourselves. Should we fail, please expect another missive, and please refrain from becoming
angered at our impudent abuse in asking thee for favors when we have yet to cross swords upon the fields of honor! We thank thee one and all for any counsel, aid, and or missives thou does render us.

Humbly, and may thy swords remain eversharp and thy foes tremble at thy approach.

|||||||||||||||| A transplanted Viking, born a millennium too late. |||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Too many Awards to list in Signature, sorry lords...|||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Listed on my page for your convenience and envy.|||||||||||||||||
Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII

[This message has been edited by Terikel706 (edited 11-29-2007 @ 03:47 AM).]

AuthorReplies:
Mythic_Commodore
Ministerialis
posted 28 November 2007 16:08 EDT (US)     1 / 21       
I haven't tried the Vikings yet, but to add in the onagers is a simple process. In your edu, simply search for "barb onager scythian". At the bottom of the unit entry, where it says "ownership scythia", simply add
", germans" so the entry looks like this: "ownership scythia, germans". Next use the pak extractor, which can be found here. In the folders it created, copy the onager icons from the UI/unit/scythia and UI/unit_info/scythia into folders in your main data folder called UI/unit/germans and UI/unit_info/germans. And the germans have the onager! Although for campaign use, you would need to edit your edb file by replacing all mention of "recruit "barb onager scythian" 0 requires factions { scythia, }" with
"recruit "barb onager scythian" 0 requires factions { scythia, germans, }"
Hope this helps

Cyclohexane - it's what's for dinner!

[This message has been edited by Mythic_Commodore (edited 11-28-2007 @ 04:12 PM).]

SubRosa
Legionary
posted 28 November 2007 16:58 EDT (US)     2 / 21       
There is a complete guide to making new units here.

Also, be sure to put the following switch to the end of your command line -show_err. That tells the game to give you an error message when it crashes.

Like so:

"C:\Rome\Rome Total War\RomeTW.exe" -show_err

[This message has been edited by SubRosa (edited 03-23-2008 @ 08:50 PM).]

Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 29 November 2007 03:47 EDT (US)     3 / 21       
Hail and wassail. Our herals shall give thee quick update on our efforts whilst the wenches bring forth our best ale for thy refreshment.

Lord Mythic Commodore, we have indeed acquired that magical pak extractor thingee and will have our saged wise men put it to good use this very night. We shall attempt thy solution to the problems of hurlers of rock for our valiant warriors.

Our scribe has received twenty lashes upon the soles of his feet for his slovenly neglecting to mention that our world has runes saying Ver 1.5.

Lady of the Plains, we have indeed heard wondrous stories of the wisdom of the famous Epostilary Richard, and indeed have perused his scribblings with extraordinary care and scrutiny. verily, it was from that famed sage we have heard of the edu, dmb and other such nonsense. In fact, in creating the entries for the onagers, we followed his advice almost to the letter, substituting German Onagers for Briton Archers. And yet we failed.

My scribe has received a further ten lashes for neglecting to mention that during our attempts, we had per file made the necessary runes, then saved, then tried to open the world. After modding the dmb, the world opened. After the eu and the edue, the world opened. Only when the edu was modified to mention Norse Vikings did the world refuse to open its portals and let us in. Therefore our priests feel the Metal Box is cursed against all things Northern and sought thy aid.

Our wizards have attempted this show_err command in various ways,with the following runes \ / - but the simple leaving a space open between the command and its add-on was not attempted.

Our whipmaster will be busy tonight. And with luck, maybe our valourous warhosts will contain hurlers of rock for the smashing of walls by the rise of the sun.

|||||||||||||||| A transplanted Viking, born a millennium too late. |||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Too many Awards to list in Signature, sorry lords...|||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Listed on my page for your convenience and envy.|||||||||||||||||
Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII

[This message has been edited by Terikel706 (edited 11-29-2007 @ 03:51 AM).]

SubRosa
Legionary
posted 29 November 2007 11:45 EDT (US)     4 / 21       
oops, I made a typo up there. It should be -show_err.

Like this:

"C:\Rome\Rome Total War\RomeTW.exe" -show_err
Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 29 November 2007 17:06 EDT (US)     5 / 21       
We have performed the actions counselled by the glorious Lord Mythic Commodore, and have failed.

Our world refused to open, damning us to the blighted Crash to Desktop after seven ticks of the water clock. After every edit of the edu, no matter how small or insignificant or correct, our world refuses to open.

Is there some unseen curse hindering our efforts? Some deeply hidden feature that refuses to accept an edu of other than the specified size and quantity of runes, perhaps?

Our most gifted and vaunted engineers have also tinkered with the magical -show_err command without success. As our world is a part of Windows XP Media Center Edition Service Pack 2, and our brilliant engineers are familiar with Windows 98 SE, we sought for eons in vain for the command prompt and were forced to try the genial -show_err after the quotes in Run, in the quotes, and even discovered the command prompt and changed the name of the program to RomeTW.exe-show_err, all without success.

So we have no hurlers of large rocks, and must refute all claims to our Northern brethren, unless another gifted alchemist can come forward with wise counsel.

[This message has been edited by Terikel706 (edited 11-30-2007 @ 01:20 AM).]

SubRosa
Legionary
posted 29 November 2007 18:09 EDT (US)     6 / 21       
Could you post the text of the units you are working on here? Seeing them might help to figure out what is wrong.

While you are at it, how about copying and pasting the command line of your Rome shortcut here too.
Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 30 November 2007 02:03 EDT (US)     7 / 21       
Gracious Lady of the Ocean of Grass, thy will is here done:

type norse vikings
dictionary norse_vikings_german ; Norse Vikings
category infantry
class heavy
voice_type Heavy_1
soldier barb_warguard, 25, 0, 1.5
officer barb_standard
attributes sea_faring, hide_forest, frighten_foot, very_hardy
formation 1.2, 1.2, 2.4, 2.4, 2, square
stat_health 2, 0
stat_pri 13, 3, pilum, 35, 2, thrown, blade, piercing, spear, 25 ,1
stat_pri_attr prec, thrown ap
stat_sec 16, 7, no, 0, 0, melee, simple, piercing, sword, 25 ,1
stat_sec_attr no
stat_pri_armour 7, 5, 5, metal
stat_sec_armour 0, 0, flesh
stat_heat 2
stat_ground 2, -2, 3, 2
stat_mental 12, impetuous, untrained
stat_charge_dist 30
stat_fire_delay 0
stat_food 60, 300
stat_cost 1, 700, 120, 100, 140, 700
ownership germans

As for the command line, we must ask our scribes in the court to find that for thee as we are out and about in our saddle, surveying our realm, at this very moment and cannot seek through the Metal Box which is in the Royal Hovel. We shall append it later.

EDIT: Our sages cannot find an item in the shortcut called Command Line. Our target runes read as "C:\Old D Drive\Games\Rome Total Mod\RomeTW.exe" We hope that aided thee in aiding us.

[This message has been edited by Terikel706 (edited 11-30-2007 @ 11:59 AM).]

SubRosa
Legionary
posted 30 November 2007 18:00 EDT (US)     8 / 21       
First, change the command line in the target box to this:

"C:\Old D Drive\Games\Rome Total Mod\RomeTW.exe" -show_err

Next, could you please post the entries for the Viking unit in the following files:
RTW\Data\export_descr_unit_enums.txt
RTW\Data\descr_model_battle.txt
RTW\Data\export_descr_buildings.txt
RTW\Data\Text\export_units.txt

Next, I have found one problem with the Viking unit. You have it using a thrown weapon and a melee weapon. But you have the game using a model that only has a melee weapon. You have to pick a model that uses the same weapons you wish to replicate. First the game cannot render the thrown weapon since it is not part of the model you are trying to use. Second the model cannot throw it since it does not have the proper animation linked to the .cas file.

The Franks have a unit that can throw an axe and then fight in melee, the Francisca Heerbann. My suggestion would be to go to Barbarian Invasion and copy the model and texture files it uses to Rome Total war, then create a new entry in descr_model_battle.txt to point to both. You could probably just copy that from Barbarian Invasion as well, and just change whatever names are appropriate, such as the faction name.

[This message has been edited by SubRosa (edited 12-01-2007 @ 00:37 AM).]

Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 01 December 2007 04:43 EDT (US)     9 / 21       
Most Enlightened Warchieftainess of the Plains, thy will be done.

edue:
norse_vikings
norse_vikings_descr
norse_vikings_descr_short

eu:
{norse_vikings}Norse Vikings

{norse_vikings_descr}
Norse Vikings are fearsome giants from the mythical frozen land of Thule who strike fear and awe into their foes.\nA head taller than any other man, Vikings are experts with their long swords and terrible axes. The thick chainmail of the Viking can shed swordblows and arrows like rain.\n\nVikings are also renowned traders whose voyages are legendary.
{norse_vikings_descr_short}
Norse Vikings are fearsome giants from the mythical frozen land of Thule who strike fear and awe into their foes.

dmb:

type norse_vikings
skeleton fs_slow_swordsman
indiv_range 40
texture germans, data/models_unit/textures/unit_barb_warguard_gaul.tga
model_flexi data/models_unit/unit_barb_warguard_400.cas, 8
model_flexi data/models_unit/unit_barb_warguard_300.cas, 15
model_flexi data/models_unit/unit_barb_warguard_200.cas, 30
model_flexi data/models_unit/unit_barb_warguard_100.cas, 40
model_flexi data/models_unit/unit_barb_warguard_70.cas, max
model_sprite 60.0, data/sprites/barb_warguard_sprite.spr
model_sprite germans, 60.0, data/sprites/gauls_barb_warguard_sprite.spr
model_tri 400, 0.5f, 0.5f, 0.5f

As yet our scribes have yet to make the runes for the edb as we have taken things step by step and wanted to test the warband in custom battle before making it recruitable. But the entry we would have done would look like this, under Sacred Circle of Freyja:

recruit "norse vikings" 0 requires factions { germans, }

We feel foolish already after reading thy runes concerning the model and its lack of abilities for what we desire. We shall install during the course of the sun's journey across the sky the variant world of Brotherly Immigration and peruse its innards for this Franciska heerbann. Verily, we shall follow thy advice in copying and then editing the lines therein to see if our Vikings come to life.

If thy advice leads to success, methinks we shall try a second warband of Vikings, simply a barb_warguard with no axe throwing for before the Coming of the Great Marius, and this axe-throwing version for after.

We shall keep thee informed.

EDIT:
We have installed Brotherly Imigration and perused the entry for the axe-throwers. Their item is francisca, which may cause problems as our Romeburg: Total Mod directory is a copy of the Rome: Total War directory and Brotherly Immigration installed itself by mystical means into the Rome Total War directory. Methinks it best to dismiss the idea of axe throwing and use the Vikings as simple swordsmen.

|||||||||||||||| A transplanted Viking, born a millennium too late. |||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Too many Awards to list in Signature, sorry lords...|||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Listed on my page for your convenience and envy.|||||||||||||||||
Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII

[This message has been edited by Terikel706 (edited 12-02-2007 @ 04:22 AM).]

SubRosa
Legionary
posted 01 December 2007 13:41 EDT (US)     10 / 21       
You can still use the models and textures from BI. Just copy the .cas files for the BI_unit_francisca_heerbanxxx from the BI\Data\Models_Unit folder to the same folder of Rome. Do the same with all the BI_unit_francisca_heerbanxxx.dds files in the BI\Data\Models_Unit\Textures folder. You might not have a textures folder for RTW, if not, just go ahead and create one (the textures are normally all stored in the pack files).

I found some other problems with your code too.

The Dictionary name in Export_descr_unit.txt has to match the entries for the unit in Export_units.txt and Export_descr_unit_enums.txt. So change them to the following:

Export_descr_unit_enums.txt
norse_vikings_german
norse_vikings_german_descr
norse_vikings_german_descr_short


Export_descr_unit.txt
----------------

{norse_vikings_german}Norse Vikings

{norse_vikings_german_descr}
\n\nNorse Vikings are fearsome giants from the mythical frozen land of Thule who strike fear and awe into their foes.\n\nA head taller than any other man, Vikings are experts with their long swords and terrible axes. The thick chainmail of the Viking can shed swordblows and arrows like rain.\n\nVikings are also renowned traders whose voyages are legendary.

{norse_vikings_german_descr_short}
Norse Vikings are fearsome giants from the mythical frozen land of Thule who strike fear and awe into their foes.


Also, the Type name in Descr_Model_Battle.txt has to match the Soldier name given in Export_Descr_Unit.txt. So you need to change one of them to match the other. If you want to try to use the francisca heerban from BI, try using the following code in Descr_Model_Battle.txt:

Descr_Model_Battle.txt
type francisca_heerban ;Norse Vikings
skeleton fs_javelinman, fs_slow_swordsman
indiv_range 40
texture germans, data/models_unit/textures/BI_unit_francisca_heerban_franks.tga
model_flexi data/models_unit/BI_unit_francisca_heerban_lod1.cas, 15
model_flexi data/models_unit/BI_unit_francisca_heerban_lod2.cas, 30
model_flexi data/models_unit/BI_unit_francisca_heerban_lod3.cas, max
model_sprite germans, 60.0, bi/data/sprites/franks_francisca_heerban_sprite.spr
model_tri 400, 0.5f, 0.5f, 0.5f

Then change your Export_Descr_Unit.txt entry to this:

Export_Descr_Unit.txt
type norse vikings
dictionary norse_vikings_german ; Norse Vikings
category infantry
class heavy
voice_type Heavy_1
soldier francisca_heerban, 25, 0, 1.5
officer barb_standard
attributes sea_faring, hide_forest, frighten_foot, very_hardy
formation 1.2, 1.2, 2.4, 2.4, 2, square
stat_health 2, 0
stat_pri 13, 3, pilum, 35, 2, thrown, blade, piercing, spear, 25 ,1
stat_pri_attr prec, thrown ap
stat_sec 16, 7, no, 0, 0, melee, simple, piercing, sword, 25 ,1
stat_sec_attr no
stat_pri_armour 7, 5, 5, metal
stat_sec_armour 0, 0, flesh
stat_heat 2
stat_ground 2, -2, 3, 2
stat_mental 12, impetuous, untrained
stat_charge_dist 30
stat_fire_delay 0
stat_food 60, 300
stat_cost 1, 700, 120, 100, 140, 700
ownership germans


That should do it. If I get time today I will try it myself.

EDIT:

I gave it a try and it works. The only things I found were that the axes look like pila when they are thrown, and that I need to rename the unit cards I copied from BI. Oh, they also retain their axe to fight in melee as well. The only way to change that would be to open the model in 3dsmax and give it a sword as a secondary weapon.

Some screens so far:







EDIT:

I fixed the unit cards too. Just copy the francisca_heerban cards from BI\Data\UI\Unit_Info\Franks and BI\Data\UI\Units\Franks to the equivalent folders in RTW. Then rename them as the following:
Unit_Info\Germans: norse_vikings_german_info.tga
Units\Germans: #norse_vikings_german.tga





[This message has been edited by SubRosa (edited 12-01-2007 @ 05:40 PM).]

SubRosa
Legionary
posted 01 December 2007 18:01 EDT (US)     11 / 21       
I went and gave the Onagers a shot too, following the advice of Mythic_Commodore. It did not work at first because I forgot to put the comma in after the word germans in the buildings.txt file.

Export_descr_buildings.txt
recruit "barb onager scythian" 0 requires factions { scythia, germans, }


Export_descr_unit.txt
type barb onager scythian
dictionary barb_onagers_scythian ; Onagers
category siege
class missile
voice_type Light_1
soldier barb_crew, 16, 2, 0.9
engine onager
attributes sea_faring
formation 1.5, 1.5, 3, 3, 3, square
stat_health 1, 0
stat_pri 4, 2, no, 0, 0, melee, simple, piercing, knife, 25 ,1
stat_pri_attr no
stat_sec 53, 2, boulder, 300, 30, siege_missile, blade, blunt, none, 25 ,1
stat_sec_attr ap, bp, area, launching
stat_pri_armour 0, 3, 2, flesh
stat_sec_armour 0, 0, flesh
stat_heat 0
stat_ground 0, 0, 0, 0
stat_mental 4, normal, untrained
stat_charge_dist 30
stat_fire_delay 0
stat_food 60, 300
stat_cost 1, 730, 110, 80, 110, 730
ownership scythia, germans


Unit Cards
Copy the following two files from your unpacked files:

RTW\Data\UI\Unit_Info\Scythia\ BARB_ONAGERS_SCYTHIAN_INFO.TGA
RTW\Data\UI\Units\Scythia\ #BARB_ONAGERS_SCYTHIAN.TGA

To the following folders (the filenames do not need to be changed):

RTW\Data\UI\Unit_Info\Germans\ BARB_ONAGERS_SCYTHIAN_INFO.TGA
RTW\Data\UI\Units\Germans\ #BARB_ONAGERS_SCYTHIAN.TGA





[This message has been edited by SubRosa (edited 12-02-2007 @ 01:03 PM).]

Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 02 December 2007 15:41 EDT (US)     12 / 21       
We have followed thy counsel to the very rune, most Wise Shamaness, and must report.... SUCCESS! Both hurlers of rocks and our crazed brethren from the mystical North have appeared upon our world.

After much thought and skull-rattling, we have decided to have the Vikings recruitable from the same ports they would visit, thus our shipwrights who produce the longships now can recruit Viking warriors to our banners. Plus, this means the burg must reach the highest level of development, which suits us for such strong warriors, and they shall spread as we spread- much as in the real world.

We thank thee profusely and unabashed for thy aid in this weighty and skull-crushing problem that has vexed us for weeks now. Thank thee!

May thy sword remain eversharp and thy foes tremble at thy approach,

Terikel

|||||||||||||||| A transplanted Viking, born a millennium too late. |||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Too many Awards to list in Signature, sorry lords...|||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Listed on my page for your convenience and envy.|||||||||||||||||
Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII
SubRosa
Legionary
posted 02 December 2007 16:04 EDT (US)     13 / 21       
Thank you for O Mighty Raven-Feeder. I think that is very ingenious of you to make them recruitable from ports. That never would have occurred to me. In fact, I do not think I have ever seen that done in any of the major mods either. In retrospect, it is the ideal way for pirate-type units to be recruited.
Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 03 December 2007 06:33 EDT (US)     14 / 21       
Thou art most welcome, Genius of the Metal Box. It is nice to know our attempt at creating was not a venture of total folly and that we did have some decent ideas in there somewhere.

We are not quite finished with the Vikings, but now that they are recruitable and appear in our world, we can tweak the stats and quantities of yellow metal they shall demand to balance them a bit better. Methinks a joining fee of 1000 is better suiting than the 700, and upkeep of such warriors and their metal skins would be rather 230 as per the Sandal-wearing uber troopies. Or, tone down the stats so that they are worth the given price and not more. We must think long and hard over this, but now we have the time to do so. Thank thee again for that ability! Also, we are thinking of making the secondary armament axes, which we all know they did use, and would fit better with the animation.

The portrait of these seafaring warriors was wonderful with the sea-blue colors, yet we have found another that we use and managed with our small abilities to make work as a Unit Info card. It is of a Viking warrior with a Viking ship in the background. Nice to be reminded from whence these warriors can be called, eh?

Thank thee again, for all the immense aid thou has so freely given.

EDIT:
We have decided to use the francisca heerban unit card in place from the one we had originally made. We retain the Viking and longship portrait for the Unit Info, though. A nice mix, and thank thee again for the idea to use the animation from the Brotherly Immigration and the very large aid in adjusting the coding.

[This message has been edited by Terikel706 (edited 12-04-2007 @ 03:06 AM).]

Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 04 December 2007 15:16 EDT (US)     15 / 21       
Aiee! Something in our world is corrupt!

We have recruited a stout band of hardy Northern warriors to our banners, and this very night we have engaged a horde clad in bedsheets in honorbale combat. We arrived on the field, deployed our valiant vikings to the flanks of our spearbands, and our horseborne to the rear to await the breaking of our foes and forcing a flank.

And what occurred?

Our wonderful world of blood and battle disintegrated in a very unexpected Crash to Desktop. And worse, our subtle command -show_err seems to show the error only to itself and not to us.

We did notice that our valiant Vikings did disappear when our Eye in the Sky pulled away, but that situation we remedied with the simple extraction of Sprites and insertion of the same into the data\sprites folder.

Is there any helpful Genius out there who can gather from this missive the information needed to deduce the cause of this unwanted CTD and aid this forlorn warrior in his hour of desperation?

|||||||||||||||| A transplanted Viking, born a millennium too late. |||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Too many Awards to list in Signature, sorry lords...|||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Listed on my page for your convenience and envy.|||||||||||||||||
Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII

[This message has been edited by Terikel706 (edited 12-04-2007 @ 03:17 PM).]

Mythic_Commodore
Ministerialis
posted 04 December 2007 15:55 EDT (US)     16 / 21       
So does it still crash when the camera moves too far away from the soldiers after the sprite fix? Or does it crash at some other time, randomly? I tried messing up the sprite entries in my descr_model_battle.txt, and all that I found was that when the game cannot find the right sprites, it decides to use the default sprites for the model. If it cannot find default sprites for the model, then it may crash. Something to try is to go to the entry in descr_model_battle for the Vikings. When you're there, go to the line that says:
model_sprite germans, 60.0, bi/data/sprites/franks_francisca_heerban_sprite.spr
and remove the bi/ from the beginning.
I can't think of anything else, but in my experience, CTDs with no error message usually signify that the game cannot find something that it is looking for.

Cyclohexane - it's what's for dinner!
SubRosa
Legionary
posted 04 December 2007 20:44 EDT (US)     17 / 21       
I think I see the problem. It is looking for the sprite but not finding it in the folder I had specified. Just take the entire sprite line out of your Descr_Model_Battle.txt file, like so:


type francisca_heerban ;Norse Vikings
skeleton fs_javelinman, fs_slow_swordsman
indiv_range 40
texture germans, data/models_unit/textures/BI_unit_francisca_heerban_franks.tga
model_flexi data/models_unit/BI_unit_francisca_heerban_lod1.cas, 15
model_flexi data/models_unit/BI_unit_francisca_heerban_lod2.cas, 30
model_flexi data/models_unit/BI_unit_francisca_heerban_lod3.cas, max
model_tri 400, 0.5f, 0.5f, 0.5f


The game will run without the sprite, in fact most user-created units do not come with sprites. If none is specified, it just does not use one, and renders the model no matter from how far away the camera is. The reason that sprites are normally used at long distances is that it is easier for the game engine to draw the sprites (being 2 dimensional), rather than the models and skins (being 3 dimensional). At that distance no one can tell it is only 2 dimensional anyhow.
Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 05 December 2007 01:25 EDT (US)     18 / 21       
We thank thee, Wonderful Warlords, for thy counsel. We see that the error must be fully explained in order for the solution to rise.

We have had our alchemists unpack the Sprites files from BI using the wonderful tool by Vercingetorix, then our scribes diligently copied all sprites for the francisca heerbann to the newly-created data/sprites folder. The effect of this magical moving was to allow the Vikings to remain visible from afar, instead of sinking into the high grass. Our magical Eye in the Sky was then commanded to view the new warriors from all angles and distances. Verily, they did appear as the stout warriors we so desire in our ranks.

The problem is definitely with these men. After several trials, with and without these stout slayers, every time they are not included in the warband, the divine Start Battle Button is clicked on and the enemy deploys and we have a merry time of it until they run away beaten and broken.

When the Vikings take the field and we have our rodent click upon the divine Start Battle button, the enemy has such fright that they do not appear and verily take the entire world with them and the Glass Curtain collapses in a catastrophic CTD.

So, within a half-second of clicking upon the Start Battle when Vikings are on the field, the CTD occurs.

Is there a file I have missed somewhere, or other modification we have neglected?

We would eagerly have our scribes emplace copies of all things connected to these valiant Vikings if that would aid thee in identifying the problem.

EDIT:
In the hours of darkness we shall remove our sacred scrolls from the Master Scriptorium of our Virtual world and emplace them in a secure vault, then diligently make yet another copy of the Virtual World where Brotherly Immigration resides, then replace our sacred scrolls from the secure vault back into the Master Scriptorium. Methinks there resides within the Master Scriptorium some changes caused by the importation of Brotherly Immigration that were not made in the Scriptorium we have dubbed Rome:Total Mod. The reasoning behind this solution is that the Vikings appeared and fought as lions in the Virtual World of the Most Gracious Lady SubRosa who has indeed Brotherly Immigration installed while the battlefield disappears in ours who do not. (Though, the only BI pieces that are in RTM are the dmb coding, the sprites, and the unit cards.)

Maybe this solution will result in the enemy realizing our Vikings are but men to be slain and not run away taking the world with them. We shall issue a report of the success or failure of this solution upon completion and battle-testing.

[This message has been edited by Terikel706 (edited 12-05-2007 @ 09:14 AM).]

SubRosa
Legionary
posted 05 December 2007 11:52 EDT (US)     19 / 21       
The problem is not that you have any other modifications installed. Unit mods are very forgiving in that regard. It is simply that the game cannot find the sprite file. If you are going to use it, you have to provide the correct path to it in the unit's entry in descr_model_battle.txt, here:

model_sprite germans, 60.0, bi/data/sprites/franks_francisca_heerban_sprite.spr

That is why I suggest simply removing that one line altogether and not using a sprite. The game will run fine without it.
Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 05 December 2007 16:05 EDT (US)     20 / 21       
Hail, High Chieftainess of the Windswept Plains.

We have removed the unsightly sprite line from the dmb scroll. Verily, we had already thought of that solution and unpacked the sprite from Brotherly Immigration and placed it in the appropriate folder in RTM. The viewing of the Vikings from all angles and distances worked fine. we had our scribes removed the offending line anyway, to test thy solution.

Verily, we could indeed see that the Vikings remain visible and there was no lag in the time.

Yet depressing the Start Battle button continued to cause the crash. We do not have the time to have our scribes perform the other solution this night, and will try again on the morrow. Methinks we remembering watching the files fly by during the installation process for brotherly Immigration and noticed that some files being added were not added directly into the BI scriptorium but rather in the Master Scriptorium. Thou has that upon thy Metal Box, and from the portraits thou has posted, thy Vikings indeed do battle. Mine simply cause the enemy to flee so fast they take the world with them, and yet both have exactly the same coding... thus there is something amiss in the battle mode. Our problem is that the vaunted -show_err does not work with our Metal Box and that battles involving Vikings cause CTD and we have no idea why.

We shall update thee with regular reports on the electronic front.

EDIT LAST:

There was an error in the primary weapon line. It is now corrected. I also battle-tested and campaign-tested these guys. The final stats are:

type norse vikings
dictionary norse_vikings_german ; Norse Vikings
category infantry
class heavy
voice_type Heavy_1
soldier francisca_heerban, 25, 0, 1
officer barb_standard
attributes sea_faring, hide_improved_forest, hide_long_grass, very_hardy, frighten_foot, warcry
formation 1.2, 1.2, 2.4, 2.4, 3, square
stat_health 1, 0
stat_pri 13, 3, pilum, 35, 2, thrown, blade, piercing, spear, 25 ,1
stat_pri_attr prec, thrown ap
stat_sec 15, 6, no, 0, 0, melee, simple, slashing, axe, 25 ,1
stat_sec_attr no
stat_pri_armour 7, 5, 5, metal
stat_sec_armour 0, 0, flesh
stat_heat 2
stat_ground 2, 0, 2, 2
stat_mental 14, impetuous, untrained
stat_charge_dist 30
stat_fire_delay 0
stat_food 60, 300
stat_cost 1, 1000, 150, 70, 70, 700
ownership germans

Since they are recruited from shipwrights, I toned down their stats to below Chosen Axemen, gave them chainmail, raised the price, and made them 1 hp. They are handy to have, yet do not dominate a battlefield. In other words, they seem balanced. And most importantly, they work!

Thanks again for all the help.

|||||||||||||||| A transplanted Viking, born a millennium too late. |||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Too many Awards to list in Signature, sorry lords...|||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Listed on my page for your convenience and envy.|||||||||||||||||
Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII

[This message has been edited by Terikel706 (edited 12-13-2007 @ 10:10 AM).]

SubRosa
Legionary
posted 23 March 2008 21:31 EDT (US)     21 / 21       
I figured out how to get the franciscas to work when they throw them.



What I had to do was go to BI\Data\Models_Missile and copy over the BI_projectile_francisca.CAS file. Then in BI\Data\Models_Missile\Textures the BI_projectile_francisca.tga.dds file. Finally I went to BI\Data\descr_projectile_new.txt file, where I copied this text from (I took out the "BI" in the pathname of the .cas file):
projectile francisca

damage 0
radius 0
mass 0.3
;area 0.1
min_angle -60
max_angle 70
velocity 30
bounce 0.3 0.4 0.7 0.9 erratic
display aimed spin
model data/models_missile/BI_projectile_francisca.CAS, max
Of course I went to the Export_Descr_Unit.txt entry and changed the weapon from pilum to francisca as well.

I also went and recolored the skins and unit cards. As you can see here:







However, in the few short Custom Battles I did I found that their unit size is too small with their current, toned down stats. They do well enough against the likes of Roman Auxilia, but standard Legionary Cohorts trounced them. I think you ought to put their numbers up to the 40 now, same as any other heavy infantry unit.

[This message has been edited by SubRosa (edited 03-24-2008 @ 01:10 AM).]

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