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Total War Heaven » Forums » Rome: Total War Discussion » Worst Starting Location?
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Topic Subject:Worst Starting Location?
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Celer
Legionary
posted 05 February 2005 01:48 EDT (US)         
Which faction endures the worst starting location in the game do you think?

For instance, I think the Selucids starting locations suck. They are surrounded/faced all around by powerful enemies such as Eygpt etc.

Another bad starting location I think is the Senate. Straight inside the middle of Italy, surrounded by power hungry Roman Families ready to overthrow the Senates empire. (Of course, I don't play the Senate.)

So fellow Forumers which faction do you think start in the worst location possible?

AuthorReplies:
mr jekl
Legionary
posted 05 February 2005 02:05 EDT (US)     1 / 44       
How about the Gauls,
they're neighbouring the Britons, Germans, Spanish, Carthaginians and the Julii. If you're at war with all 5 of them, the game will get really hard.

The greeks don't start that good either. They've their weak position on Sicily, one province in Asia-Minor and two cities in Greece, surrounded by enemies.

Hikari
Legionary
(id: echowinds)
posted 05 February 2005 03:00 EDT (US)     2 / 44       
Spain on VH/VH is a nightmare. Their two sides is split by Gaul. Carthage in the South. Since Spain is so weak in the beginning you might get thrashed by Gaul if you wage war too soon.

Germania is hard too. Not because they have tons of enemies, because they have a lot of area to defend with not a whole lot of money.


beekay
Legionary
(id: black_knight_101)
posted 05 February 2005 03:15 EDT (US)     3 / 44       
Have you ever tried playing Numidia? Only 3000 starting denarii, the Egyptians capture Siwa early on (only when you play them, though), most of the territories you conquer revolt, and if you somehow manage to hold on with Spain attacking Tingi, you'll have Carthage or the Scipii to deal with...

Although, as for the worst starting postion... I say Selucia. On vh campaign difficulty, you get attacked by Pontus, Armenia, Egypt, Parthia, Greece, and occasionally Macedon! They seem to go by sea... (well, obviously)


sig

[This message has been edited by black_knight_101 (edited 02-05-2005 @ 03:15 AM).]

Hikari
Legionary
(id: echowinds)
posted 05 February 2005 03:18 EDT (US)     4 / 44       
You need to go da blitz against Egypt. Or have them hound you for a long time. If you can take out Egpyt early, you shouldn't have a problem against the others.

Numidia has some poor units as well, compounding their probelms, not to mention a huge area, meaing its hard to reinforce anywhere from anyplace. Yeah, they are hard to play too.


Rookierookie
Banned
posted 05 February 2005 03:20 EDT (US)     5 / 44       
If you think Numidia has money problems, try playing Armenia. With Numidia, if you turtle at least you can break even. With Armenia, you are losing 1000 gold per turn from the start with highest taxes.
beekay
Legionary
(id: black_knight_101)
posted 05 February 2005 04:31 EDT (US)     6 / 44       
Wha? I, in my current campaign as Armenia, have conquered Pontus and am raking in 2500 per turn! Not much, but it's something....

sig
Sospitator
Legionary
posted 05 February 2005 11:56 EDT (US)     7 / 44       
yes, that's AFTER you take Pontus, Sinope is a good trading position.

Numidia must be one of the worst starting locations.

1. no money/no economy
2. bad starting units
3. extreme distances

their only way of survival is to concentrate all western forces and attack Carthage OR put them in a boat and sail away to Asia Minor or something (which is a good idea for most factions)

Sospitator
Legionary
posted 05 February 2005 11:57 EDT (US)     8 / 44       
by the way, I don't think the Seleucid Empire has a bad starting location. access to all wonders in no time, rich provinces, the all important Hanging Gardens from the start, access to sea... mines... god, they rule!
Themistocles472
Legionary
posted 05 February 2005 12:00 EDT (US)     9 / 44       
Of the "playables" Seleucia is the worse. Of all the factions it sounds like Numidia/Spain don't start very well.
lawler
Legionary
posted 05 February 2005 12:33 EDT (US)     10 / 44       
Parthia is also pretty bad at the start because you have Campus Sakae which is no where near your other provinces and you are bordering all the land hungry factions in the middle east. Briton has to be the easiest because you start out on an island [if only it was a rich island ]

-lawler

Siamese
Legionary
posted 05 February 2005 13:27 EDT (US)     11 / 44       
Macedonia. Romans, Dacia, Thrace, Greek Cities, and to a lesser extent, Carthage and the Seleucid Empire.

Their biggest issue is the Brutii, though.

Ace Cataphract
HG Alumnus
(id: Ace_Cataphract)
posted 05 February 2005 13:47 EDT (US)     12 / 44       
With Macedon, you start off with the Temple of Zeus, and you can easily take out the Greeks if you get into a war early on against them. Plus you have Light Lancers that are amazing early cavalry with an enourmous charge value. Levy Pikemen + Light Lancers, with some Illyrian or Cretan Mercs and you've got a kickass army that can take on anyone until the Marian Reforms.

But anyway, out of all the factions, Spain and Numidia get a really raw deal. Spain is split in half by two powers, while Numidia gets all of the crap Saharan land in Africa, and is bordering only Carthage and Egypt. Out of the playable factions I would say Seleucia since they have pretty good territories and access to wonders, etc, but they have Egypt to the south who has amazing units early on, Parthia to the North who's horse archers are ALWAYS a problem for pikemen armies, Pontus and Armenia to the north in other areas who often enough ally with Parthia to chew you up, and Greece to the West, who isn't beyond declaring war on you for one province.


I put a dollar in one of those change machines. Nothing changed. ~George Carlin

[This message has been edited by Ace_Cataphract (edited 02-05-2005 @ 01:50 PM).]

Elrond89
Legionary
posted 05 February 2005 20:45 EDT (US)     13 / 44       
I second the comment on wiping egypt early. I swear i have been trudging throught egyptian territory at an immense cost. Also the Pontics took my westernmost city in Asia Minor. Parthia has been a very faithful ally. (of course i haven't opened the leaguer of Seleucia to eniliate them) Armenia gave me trouble but they seem to have stopped either meaning a war with Pontus OR sycthians to the north. As far as egypt is concerned I took Jerusalem and executed the populous(the jewish gold was unbelieveable and irresistable). Now i just have to push egyptback into the heartland when i take the Sinai peninsula. (as you may have guessed i am the seleucids). After i take the peninsula the egyptian empire will be carved in half and i will be unstoppable with egyptian coffers and seleucid technology.

Crusade! Our brothers in the East need out swords to subdue the Infidel! The Saracen defiles the Sepulchre and is at the gates of the Roman emperor!. Ride! Ride ye holy soldiers to Jerusalem! Byzantium calls for aid...Christ and the Virgin weep at the blood of martyrs spilled on holy pilgrimages! Crusade! -Medieval 2: Total War
doitzelkaiseriii
Legionary
posted 05 February 2005 20:54 EDT (US)     14 / 44       
Of the originally playable factions, I'm going to go with the Seleucids. 'Blitzing' the Egyptians is much easier said than done. You fight Desert Axemen 10 year into the campaign, with Levy Pikemen! If your lucky you can maybe get an alliance with somebody, but then they'll just join in the fun and attack you, like everybody else! I also agree that Gaul starts off in a pretty poor position. You can't stop the Julii from attacking, nor can you stop the British or Spanish. The Germans are usually too busy with the British (or too poor) to attack... but not always. And once Carthage loses Lilybaeum, Carthage, and Thapsus they always attack Gaul. Oh, and yeah, for the Seleucids being rich- it's hard to be rich when everybody around you is attacking and not trading with you. And the cost of constantly replacing and retraining those weak units is excruciating. Oh, Armenia isn't too well-off, either (though they aren't of the originally playable factions)...

We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

[This message has been edited by DoitzelKaiserIII (edited 02-05-2005 @ 08:56 PM).]

Siamese
Legionary
posted 05 February 2005 21:01 EDT (US)     15 / 44       
10 years? Peh!

I started in 270, and when I finished conquering Egypt, it was 263!

Playing Medium campaign, Hard battles.

Scythed Chariots and pikemen...

[This message has been edited by Siamese (edited 02-05-2005 @ 09:02 PM).]

beekay
Legionary
(id: black_knight_101)
posted 05 February 2005 21:05 EDT (US)     16 / 44       
Meh, I just concentrate on getting those OP War Elphants as the Selucids

sig
KHCloud
Legionary
posted 05 February 2005 21:39 EDT (US)     17 / 44       
Carthage and Seleucia
Elrond89
Legionary
posted 05 February 2005 21:42 EDT (US)     18 / 44       
I fight a northern defensive war as seleucids with Pontus.(though i will be training an army in my capital and marching to the kingdom of Pontus to kick their ass...with a diplomat at the head to bribe all resistance so my army is intact when it comes to the siege.) In the south i am fighting off sieges of Jerusalem and will be marching on the city in the Sinai. chopping my brother greeks in half...ah the fun. Of course my roman wife Auralia asks me how i sleep at night, killing all those kindred greeks.

Crusade! Our brothers in the East need out swords to subdue the Infidel! The Saracen defiles the Sepulchre and is at the gates of the Roman emperor!. Ride! Ride ye holy soldiers to Jerusalem! Byzantium calls for aid...Christ and the Virgin weep at the blood of martyrs spilled on holy pilgrimages! Crusade! -Medieval 2: Total War
Gadz13
Legionary
posted 05 February 2005 22:36 EDT (US)     19 / 44       
Seleucide is pretty much only hard for newbs who havnt developed their startegy skills. There fairly easy to play w/ if you take SIdon adn Jerusalem.


But Spain and Numidida prbably have the worst. Actully come to think of it the rebels starting postion sucks.

Who do people think has the best?

I would have to say Britannia.

doitzelkaiseriii
Legionary
posted 05 February 2005 22:46 EDT (US)     20 / 44       
Are you trying to offend half the people on this page? The Seleucids are difficult to play as in the beginning, because their men are no match for 5 armies converging on them. Maybe if the Seleucids got a good early cavalry, like Macedon's light lancers, Egypt would be much easier to beat in the beginning. Levy Pikemen (5 attack, 6 defense) are just no match for Nile spearmen and desert axemen. For the majority of people the Seleucid Empire has a highly disadvantageous position. Even so, it wouldn't be nearly as bad if their cities grew as fast as Egypt's, or if Egypt's grew more slowly. Don't be so quick to judge and call people "noobs." It's really, really irritating when people do that, especially out of ignorance. Oh, and I was talking about the playable factions.

We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.
Roman General
Guest
posted 05 February 2005 22:52 EDT (US)     21 / 44       
Egypt is probably in a very good position. They have weak enemies all around them, and given a little riskey start, can capture cities very quickley.

Second has to be Carthage, imho. Controlling provinces on three different areas gives them a front and back door to attack the enemey. Like, say I was carthage and I wanted to attack Rome. Assuming i still held Lilybuem [sp?] and atleast Corduba, I could sandwitch the romans


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Mcbashin
Legionary
posted 06 February 2005 04:42 EDT (US)     22 / 44       
Seleucia rocks, they are in a great position to make money, and can expand fast. Does any other faction get 3 rebel towns that are 1 turn away from conquest? One of them even has a Wonder...
Not to mention they are so close to extremely weak Parthia (and a 4th rebel town if they want to challenge Parthia for it) so get an easy faction to go to war with and take out.

Carthage has a great start also, surprised it was even mentioned.
They have the most advanced city in the game at the beginning (I think), and also do well money-wise.
Not to mention they are the one faction that is in good position to take all of Italy very early in the game if you wish.

My vote is for Parthia, they absolutely stink at the beginning, you have to take over a couple settlements very early and not spend anything on army before you even start to become profitable.

[This message has been edited by Mcbashin (edited 02-06-2005 @ 04:44 AM).]

Hikari
Legionary
(id: echowinds)
posted 06 February 2005 04:52 EDT (US)     23 / 44       

Quote:

Second has to be Carthage, imho. Controlling provinces on three different areas gives them a front and back door to attack the enemey. Like, say I was carthage and I wanted to attack Rome. Assuming i still held Lilybuem and atleast Corduba, I could sandwitch the romans

I wouldn't say Carthage is all that easy. While you have acess to all that, you also need to fight against Rome, Spain and maybe Gaul, Numidians, Greece and even Egypt. Caralis will be difficult to hold since sometimes the Julii sent a lot to attack it. Corduba is always under attack by Spanish and Gaul. Carthage homelands could be under attack Numidians. Scipii sends alot against Lilybaeum. But once you can strenthen the holdings, its not that hard. It can be easy, if you know how to play.


Mcbashin
Legionary
posted 06 February 2005 05:06 EDT (US)     24 / 44       
Caralis you give up to the Julii...you're wasting resources trying to hold it.

Spain and Gaul are easily held off in the beginning. Just hire what mercs you can around Corduba, and turtle inside the city..eventually they'll run themselves out of resources attacking you.

Numidians may attack you at Carthage or thapsus, but they suck, they have no hope of taking your cities. What are they going to do, fling horse poo on you?

Greece? You can ally with Greece easily. Best bet is to bribe that Greek diplomat on Sicily and then ignore them.

Egypt wont mess with you till quite late in the game, they'll be busy fighting the Seleucids, and taking Siwa. Takes them forever to actually show up on your doorstep, and by then you could've defeated all of Rome and been starting to send armies their way anyhow.

And finally, Scipii...you can and should take them out of the game by about turn 5.

Hikari
Legionary
(id: echowinds)
posted 06 February 2005 05:10 EDT (US)     25 / 44       
Where's your fighting spirit? Never yield an inch!

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