You must be logged in to post messages.
Please login or register

Judea - Total war

Hop to:    
Welcome! You are not logged in. Please Login or Register.253 replies
Total War Heaven » Forums » Judea - Total war » Judea - Total war starting and looking for members!
Bottom
Topic Subject:Judea - Total war starting and looking for members!
« Previous Page  1 2 3 4 ··· 5  Next Page »
SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 05 June 2008 01:04 EDT (US)         
JUDEA TOTAL WAR IS A 100% OPEN MODIFICATION on the singular condition that credit is given where credit is due. ALL PROPERTY OF THE MOD IS RELEASED FOR GENERAL PUBLIC USE, DISTRIBUTION, AND/OR FURTHER ALTERATION.

ALL MATERIALS LENT OR DONATED TO JUDEA TOTAL WAR REMAIN THE PROPERTY OF THE RESPECTIVE CREATORS UNLESS OTHERWISE STATED.

AS SUCH THE CREATORS TAKE NO RESPONSIBILITY for the ultimate nature or effects of any materials. By knowing receipt of materials you consent to the above. HAPPY MODDING!




(hitties, hebrews, philistines, assyrians, kessites, babylonians, egyptians)


Alright, so i've been kicking this idea around in my head for some time, but I think i'm going to go for it now, if i can drum up support, and you all are the first to hear!

The game will use BI and start probably around 1250 BC and go (for whoever wants to) until probably around 950 BC, beginning with the bronze age collapse and ending with the time of Judges as well as the beginning of Assyrian domination.

The map will reach from the west of egypt to the iran, from the Dardanelles to central arabia.

factions (so far) :


Egypt, Ethiopia/Abyssinia

Assyrians, Babylonians

Hittites, Neo-Hitties
Philistines

Amalekites, Edomites? Midianites? Moabites?

Hebrews

GOD/senate - because there wouldn't be Hebrews without commandments. For you non-abrahamics, consider this faction as representing the religious influence, if not true divinity. Non-playable.
Sea people - Non-playable

rebels.



functions/features - what is different?

new map - which i gotta make

no navy, but wait! - this is important. God and the Sea People will have islands that cannot be reached by the player from which they will come. God will have a single city that is immensely wealthy that will trade with the hebrews - turning away from god as the hebrews will mean a huge loss of income (plagues and famine) as well as unrest. enter forced diplomacy script.

desert "towns" - non-towns that will have buildings that cannot be built, used for gathering troops in the desert. they can be built into towns later, but they will be more abstract towns than anything else, representing the "big fish" in the region rather than a true settlement.


wo do we have?

Me! I can do unit lists using existing models and brandy-new skins (see photos), and i can put a map together, and recruitment etc, but i can't do crazy stuff.

who do we need?

coders who know what they are doing! I can do everything myself if i set my mind to it, but by that point everyone will be playing Empires.

historians! i only have the bible and wikipedia and so many hours in a day to go through jstor etc.

anyone with experience putting a mod together! i'll be basically raping my home version of the game until i meet someone capable of doing non-destructive modding.

other artists! not that i can't do skins myself but more hands never hurt.

anyone interested?


all WIPs - also, legs and arms to be replaced with original skins, particularly on chariots which will sport bare arms with bracers.
http://xs128.xs.to/xs128/08234/01289.jpg
hittite swordsmen - middle infantry unit. face is strange because i'm going for 100% original which takes some practice.
http://xs128.xs.to/xs128/08234/02838.jpg
more of the hittite swordsmen.
http://xs128.xs.to/xs128/08234/04371.jpg
hittite chariots - gotta fix that darn egyptian skin, also needs to face and hat in addition to arms and legs.
http://xs128.xs.to/xs128/08234/03413.jpg
philistine skirmishers - need new shield in addition to arms and legs. also upper chest not drawn.

[This message has been edited by SrJamesTyrrel (edited 09-06-2008 @ 00:59 AM).]

AuthorReplies:
Yitzkshatriya
Legionary
posted 12 June 2008 16:10 EDT (US)     51 / 253       
I would be more than happy to help on the historical side of this mod. Early Middle Eastern History (From Sumer to the rise of the Persian Empire) is something I've researched endlessly. Also, if you are thinking of using any words of names from the cultures, I speak fluent Hebrew, I'm decent with Aramaic, and I have in my possession several Hittite, Egyptian, and Akkadian dictionaries and grammar books.

You can hit me up on AIM: yitzhakofeir... Or on Yahoo mail, yitzhak_milamit@yahoo.co.uk

[This message has been edited by Yitzkshatriya (edited 06-12-2008 @ 04:21 PM).]

Leo IV
Legionary
(id: leonadas_IV)
posted 12 June 2008 16:58 EDT (US)     52 / 253       
or by "to the judges" do you mean to the beginning of the judges? because we're going all the way through Saul


Ohhhhh okay thats where i was getting confused.

LEO IV
Pugna Concusio ~ Fight the Oppression
Army Commander
SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 13 June 2008 12:43 EDT (US)     53 / 253       
it's an easy mistake to make, i talk in circles :P


Also, i know i said no screenshots for a while, but i just can't nail down what i want to be a bleached, dirtied tunic (but still the faction colors).



also, forgive the odd flesh splicing, like i said we're doing 100% original so that's all placeholder.





also, i haven't had time to get myself organized or ask people what tasks they might want, but i believe there were some modelers who spoke up about being interested? here's a brief list of things i know we'll need eventually, they're all pretty simple I just don't have the equipment when I'm not at university:

Kopesh - mostly for Israelites and Sinai tribes, as the empires will have moved on to short dagger-swords and eventually iron weapons. (note: see below)

Asymmetrical peltast and slinger (same as normal peltast and slinger just unwrapped to allow both sides of the torso to be drawn).

a four-horse chariot , basically a box with big wheels and strings, shouldn't be too hard.

if it's not too much of a hassle, this swallow-tail barding is really popular : [JPEG; NAME="ASSYRIAN.JPG", (331.38 KB)] but it might dick too much with the wrapping.

true conical helm units (just the normal conical helm stretched), ideally archers and spearmen ... it's for the assyrians and kessite-babylonians mostly...

Ass (this is tougher, as it requires real sculpting to get the forms right). here is a good shot for size http://worldofwonder.net/donkey.jpg

Also, ideally, an ass or mule with packs, I'm thinking about an "pilgrims" type unit (a large, unarmed band with donkeys in tow, useless in battle - used to move populations from desert to town.) Pilgrims would count as siege engines on the battle map (so slow moving) and, though they could easily be retired during offensive movements, would be vulnerable to enemy ambush. Ideally though they would be all but necessary to increase the populations of cities, particularly in judea, hired maybe even as mercenary units in the wilderness, to represent nomadic groups or straggling exodites being slowly gathered. http://www.dkimages.com/discover/previews/739/128544.JPG




Note about kopesh: it might be good just to put a "board on a stick" - two planes mapped to the same part of the skin about two or three regular sword-widths apart, which we could cut using alpha channels on the skin to form a myriad of dagger and axe shapes.

[This message has been edited by SrJamesTyrrel (edited 06-13-2008 @ 12:50 PM).]

PrivateClark
Legionary
posted 13 June 2008 16:29 EDT (US)     54 / 253       
but i believe there were some modelers who spoke up about being interested?
I offered to help out a bit with modeling, and anything else (besides coding) for that matter.

Also, i really like the peltlast, nice texture, it is difficult to do recolor a tunic in white, i suggest either using maybe an overlay or a multiply setting (dont know if itl work) or to do paint the tunic yourself using the dodge, burn, etc. tools. You could also paint in some various colors with a brush.
SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 13 June 2008 16:58 EDT (US)     55 / 253       
here's the current layers, so you know i don't ever do destructive editing , and how they look taken off one by one:

http://xs128.xs.to/xs128/08245/layas162.jpg[GIF, (271.82 KB)]

(actually, watching that animation makes me realize just how dark the make the skin on the sides...I knew they darkenned, just not that they darkened SO MUCH...that might help me make him a little more round).

but nah we're not having a painting or technical issue, it's mostly just how and where to put the color so that it looks more like dust and sunbleach. I think if i do more with hue and less with value it will come back towards dirty/poor and less like a tiedye...


Hebrew Infantry btw. his colors are a little blown out right now (and bright) because of this durned weather mod that i need to get rid of. once i get th light set i'll adjust value and hue for real, right now it's mostly local changes (because i can measure those).


we're getting there, slowly...


just to give you an idea of how WIP he is, here's with only the original material filled in and the rest checkboard:



[This message has been edited by SrJamesTyrrel (edited 06-13-2008 @ 05:44 PM).]

PrivateClark
Legionary
posted 13 June 2008 18:22 EDT (US)     56 / 253       
Actualy, i really like the white cloth texture, looks pretty good, all you'd need to do is add faction colors (if you are going to) and maybe add som dust, maybe some tears as well?
SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 13 June 2008 19:52 EDT (US)     57 / 253       
i'm really confused, you seem to be running a play-by-play of the things i've already done?
PrivateClark
Legionary
posted 13 June 2008 20:50 EDT (US)     58 / 253       
Oh, didn't completely understand your post, sorry about that, wasn't sure if you were going to add faction colors or you were going to leave it white, anyway i like how it turned out. However, how come you haven't used the white texture in that screen below?
SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 13 June 2008 20:55 EDT (US)     59 / 253       
because the faction color is steely blue with white accents ^^.

i figured i wouldn't make it hard edged the way i normally do because shepherds are not necessarily concerned with even, crisp trim.


As far as the white, I'm concerned....you are only seeing it in the second to last frame of the animation, right? All the rest are blue? If any other shot of this guy looks white (or gray), you'll need to adjust your monitor asap .
PrivateClark
Legionary
posted 13 June 2008 21:15 EDT (US)     60 / 253       
yeah, looks good.

Yeah the white is only near the end... isnt that an evolution of the texture, as in what it wa and what you turned it into? Which is why i figured you started off the blue tunic and made it white, right?

EDIT: on your peltast, the lack of hair on the back of your peltast's head seems sorta weird...

[This message has been edited by PrivateClark (edited 06-13-2008 @ 09:16 PM).]

SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 13 June 2008 21:44 EDT (US)     61 / 253       
the animation is taking layers away. the skin is just there to have color to judge hue against (you don't know how blue your blue is until you see it against bronze), which is why it looks odd, as the real flesh has not been drawn yet.

all of this information is in my posts...?
PrivateClark
Legionary
posted 13 June 2008 22:53 EDT (US)     62 / 253       
Oh! i see your retracting layers each time, i thought you were adding...which sort of didn't make sense because it ended up with the vanilla Egyptian guy... Ok i understand now
SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 15 June 2008 16:06 EDT (US)     63 / 253       
no bigs

for those who didn't see me "oh gnoes" thread, we've got assyrian heads now (pointed helm, beard, and poofy hair).

demonstration on Assyrian Foot Archers (WIP as always):



Also, had the idea that truly Assyrian units would mostly be available from buildings that only they can construct. Standard buildings that they conquer will provide Assyrian Allied/Auxilia units, which are not fantastically weaker, but have notably decreased morale.

Also, working on Assyrian Guardsmen and Assyrian Royal Guard, which use the characteristic cone-shield, and a tall-shield unit as well which will be used for Assyrian Infantry and Allied Infantry. From there it's a flat, round wicker shield for the light infantry...
PrivateClark
Legionary
posted 15 June 2008 20:53 EDT (US)     64 / 253       
Looking good although the hair coming from the back of his head looks a bit blocky, maybe its the angle of the shot?
SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 15 June 2008 21:41 EDT (US)     65 / 253       
not the shot - it is a little blocky

but it's a pain to add vertices and i don't think anyone will notice in battle. will be a bit better when i draw hair (is flat color atm which increases blockiness). I don't want to start out cutting corners but i do want to move at a reasonable pace.


there's a few of them together, once there gets to be multiple units on the screen the blocky is less noticeable.




Also, darnit!

I was working on making certain babylonian and assyrian units carry standing shields into battle, which would essentially be balistas that didn't fire and used a new .cas, and come one man to one shield. The units would navigate to the battle lines and then "drop equipment" and be free to act as archers, skirmishers, or spearmen. The shields would, like other seige engines, provide a silhouette against missiles and be an obstacle to a direct charge.

I got halfway through making them before i realized that the AI wouldn't know to deploy them, so they'd be completely useless except when the player was using them. As it's impossible to balance a game like that, i've stopped, but here's a picture of the model in case anyone wants to use it :





Also, i went around RTW's hardcoded "2 horse maximum" for chariots by creating a .cas that contained two horses. The only funny thing (and it's really quite funny) is that these horses are determined to die on top of each other, in stacks, because fo the way they are positioned :



I think though that this will not be too distracting, and i see no other way of getting those empire-changing machines in game.

[This message has been edited by SrJamesTyrrel (edited 06-16-2008 @ 01:17 AM).]

Boetje
Legionary
posted 16 June 2008 01:23 EDT (US)     66 / 253       
FATW has 4 horse chariots for Rhun, perhaps you could ask them?

Yep, it's true, having no sig is boring. But so is this one. Which makes my point... relatively pointless.
Can a point be a point when it is pointless?
Andalus
Legionary
posted 16 June 2008 11:48 EDT (US)     67 / 253       
In the picture of the dead horses: Is that a phalanx I see? Tell me it's not.
SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 16 June 2008 12:29 EDT (US)     68 / 253       
So far the mod has a grand total of maybe 12 hours of work on it, so we didn't have an infantry unit capable of countering chariots easily - i just used RTR phalangites to quickly produce dead horses for the screenshot.


a list of the units in progress:

Hebrews -
skirmishers - guys in the blue crude shirts, skinning
veteran swordsmen - not pictured, skinned

Hittites -
light chariots - pictured earlier, nearly skinned
anatolian swordsmen - pictured earlier, skinned

Philistines -
light spearmen - pictured earlier, skinning and modeling
heavy spearmen - not pictured, skinning and modeling

Assyrians -
assyrian archers - pictured earlier, skinned and modeled
assyrian guard - not pictured, skinned and modeled
imperial bodygaurd - not pictured, skinning and modeled


heavy chariots - early stages (this is a tough one because it requires four horses)


mounted archers - early stages
this is a tough one because it is not unlike the chariot - having two models bound together as a single unit. One man fires his bow while the other holds both reigns. I have two ideas, the first is to use .cas files that contain double units (and suffer the piling qualities of the chariot, although notably less so as the horses will be arranged differently), or to use a chariot style with an invisible cart and "freeze" the legs of the riders (take out the bones) into a more horsemanly position. either way we end up with a skrimishing bow unit that is hard to use because of its vulnerability but unique on the battlefield for speed and accuracy of shot.

hopefully there's an easy way to make chariots much slower than they were in vanilla - perhaps a heavy horse skeleton - but most likely just quick to tire : I have never ridden a chariot, but these men could use bows while riding (i.e. not holding on with their hands) and stand in a backless cart - surely they can't have gone very fast or hit very hard because the riders would be left or launched! not to mention horses at full gallop - easy for a a seasoned ride - would injure themselves and break the machines. rome doesn't support canter or half-gallop, but i think we can still slow them down a bit somehow.
CaesarVincens
Legionary
posted 16 June 2008 13:12 EDT (US)     69 / 253       
SrJames, I can now make your map for you. I've been working hard at map modding over the last week or so. And I've figured out nearly everything need to know to make a map. So if you wish, send me that picture you were using as you map idea and I'll get something working.
Oh, and what dimensions would you like? The vanilla maps are 255 by 156; I can go larger or smaller.

Veni, Vidi, well... you know.

Extended Cultures, A modification of RTW.

Si hoc legere posses, Latinam linguam scis.
ɪf ju kæn ɹid ðɪs, ju noʊ liŋgwɪstɪks.
SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 16 June 2008 13:33 EDT (US)     70 / 253       
sweeeet! I've been looking a bit a that myself but i must admit i found it daunting.



there's the test that i put together, with light green to be divided up into regions and dark green to be other isles. and it's notably smaller but i think that's for the better. vanilla maps waste so much space. your call though.

also, Leo IV has provided these excellent links:


map of sinai region with towns, mountains, and wilderness marked.

map of greater region with towns, mountains, and rivers clear to follow.



also, i didn't acknowledge a few things - caesar's ocean ideas, Yitzkshatriya's volunteering, both of these are great news .



soon I'm going to put together a real organization of this so that we can move forward like a real team.

ROSTER:

if you have any questions, would like to volunteer, or would like to be assigned a task, please post here.

SrJamesTyrell/Me - de facto team leader, visuals. tasks: exploring possibilities and skinning assyrians, mostly visual but also unit and building rosters. Oh, and organizing - when he gets to it.

CaesarVincens - volunteered for coding. tasks: currently taking on all possible problems with ridiculous speed. maps, buildings, and anything else he likes. self-directed.

George Maxentius - volunteered for history. tasks: faction research. self-driected.

LeoIV - volunteered for history. tasks: world/map research. self-driected.

pokejunkie11 - volunteered for code/factions. tasks: not assigned.

PrivateClark - volunteered for visuals. tasks: not assigned.

Yitzkshatriya- volunteered for history. tasks: not assigned.

[This message has been edited by SrJamesTyrrel (edited 06-17-2008 @ 12:02 PM).]

CaesarVincens
Legionary
posted 16 June 2008 13:39 EDT (US)     71 / 253       
Sorry, I need a file I can download, you can send it to me via my e-mail in my profile. As for the size it is mostly based on how many provinces you want, I think there are around 100 provinces in the vanilla map to give you an idea of scale.

Veni, Vidi, well... you know.

Extended Cultures, A modification of RTW.

Si hoc legere posses, Latinam linguam scis.
ɪf ju kæn ɹid ðɪs, ju noʊ liŋgwɪstɪks.
CaesarVincens
Legionary
posted 16 June 2008 19:45 EDT (US)     72 / 253       
I've got a base map working; now it's only a matter of adding provinces and making the map look nice (it's all flat right now.)

Anyway, now I need input from our historians as to what cities existed and where they were.

Veni, Vidi, well... you know.

Extended Cultures, A modification of RTW.

Si hoc legere posses, Latinam linguam scis.
ɪf ju kæn ɹid ðɪs, ju noʊ liŋgwɪstɪks.
PrivateClark
Legionary
posted 16 June 2008 20:42 EDT (US)     73 / 253       
George Maxentius
Legionary
posted 17 June 2008 07:57 EDT (US)     74 / 253       
Well seems that I am a new one here but I can help in Judaea as a historian here. For the beginning I brought you something nice about the Hittites.

The Hittites were an ancient Anatolian people who spoke a language of the Anatolian branch of the Indo-European language family, and established a kingdom centered at Hattusa (Hittite URUḪattuša) in north-central Anatolia ca. the 18th century BC. The Hittite empire reached its height ca. the 14th century BC, encompassing a large part of Anatolia, north-western Syria about as far south as the mouth of the Litani River (a territory known as Amqu), and eastward into upper Mesopotamia. After ca. 1180 BC, the empire disintegrated into several independent "Neo-Hittite" city-states, some surviving until as late as the 8th century BC.The term "Hittites" was taken from the KJV translation of the Hebrew Bible, translating חתי HTY, or בנית BNY-HT "Children of Heth" (Heth being son of Canaan). The archaeologists who discovered the Anatolian Hittites in the 19th century initially identified them with these Biblical Hittites. Today the identification of the Biblical peoples with either the Hattusa-based empire or the Neo-Hittite kingdoms is a matter of dispute.The Hittite kingdom was commonly called the Land of Hatti by the Hittites themselves. The fullest expression is, "The Land of the City of Hattusa". This description could be applied to either the entire empire, or more narrowly just to the core territory, depending upon context. The word "Hatti" is actually an Akkadogram, rather than Hittite; it is never declined according to Hittite grammar rules. Despite the use of "Hatti", the Hittites should be distinguished from the Hattians, an earlier people who inhabited the same region until the beginning of the 2nd millennium BC, and spoke a non-Indo-European language called Hattic. The Hittites themselves referred to their language as Nesili (or in one case, Kanesili), an adverbial form meaning "in the manner of (Ka)nesa", presumably reflecting a high concentration of Hittite speakers in the ancient city of Kanesh (modern Kültepe, Turkey). Many modern city names in Turkey are first recorded under their Hittite names, such as Sinop and Adana, reflecting the contiguity of modern Anatolia with its ancient past.Although belonging to the Bronze Age, the Hittites were forerunners of the Iron Age, developing the manufacture of iron artifacts from as early as the 14th century BC, when letters to foreign rulers reveal the demand for their iron goods. The Hittites were not, however, the first to work iron, and iron remained a precious metal throughout the history of their empire. The Hittites were also famous for their skill in building and using chariots.

Of course don't think that I wrote all this stuff myself. I haven't finished the Hittites yet but I will continue with the Sea Peoples and come back to the Hittites later:

The Late Bronze Age in the Aegean was characterized by raiding and resettling of threatening and migratory peoples, sometimes used as mercenaries by the Egyptians, and operating primarily on land. Many were not listed as Sea Peoples. Among them were the 'prw (Habiru) of Egyptian inscriptions, or 'apiru of cuneiform ("bandits"), and the Maryannu, who had Indo-European names. Sandars uses the analogous name, "land peoples." Some people, such as the Lukka, were in both categories. Some scholars suspect that the Habiru are the same as the Hebrews.The identity of the sea peoples has been an enigma to modern scholars, who have only the scattered records of ancient civilizations and archaeology to inform them. The evidence shows that the identities and motives of these peoples were not unknown to the Egyptians; in fact, many had been subordinate to them or in a diplomatic relationship with them for at least as long as the few centuries covered by the records.

[This message has been edited by George Maxentius (edited 06-17-2008 @ 08:07 AM).]

SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 17 June 2008 12:00 EDT (US)     75 / 253       
wow, well that's one hell of an application!

welcome aboard . Updated the list.

Also - lets make a note of it - Hittites need their faction traits and starting positions tweaked so that the neo-hittites will emerge within the first ten to fifteen years and be strong enough to completely replace the hittites before the iron age sets in. We can't assure any of this, but we can make it "likely". At least we won't have "britons" running all across gaul and germania :P.




Caesar - excellent start! and fast!

[This message has been edited by SrJamesTyrrel (edited 06-17-2008 @ 12:07 PM).]

Andalus
Legionary
posted 17 June 2008 15:22 EDT (US)     76 / 253       
I know I said I couldn't commit myself, but you can add me to the list if you like, as some kind of independent advisor/freelance historian/poor Andalus lets give him a title.

Is there anything you currently need ideas for? Me being a fount of imagination, call on me when ever you want!

I could also write a few unit descriptions.
Ischenous
Legionary
posted 17 June 2008 16:12 EDT (US)     77 / 253       
Hittites need their faction traits
Traits? I may help be of use here. I can't get BI to work so someone else will need to test them. I *may be of use for history and cities, as I have a fair bit of time. No promises on history though.

Calling all new people. USE THE SEARCH FUNCTION before asking a question. Thank you.
Alert the APOCOLYPSE is coming!!!!!!!

BOOOOOOOOOOOOOM(Itcame)
"TWH Guild Award (Best Duo/Trio) -Ischenous/IJ"- Tryhard. Why he chose that nomination, I don't know...
George Maxentius
Legionary
posted 17 June 2008 16:30 EDT (US)     78 / 253       
I come now to complete the Hittites by their religion. As I would advice the religion matter is a good one so it should appear like the BI version example: Christianity, Paganism. There is a catalog of religions to use
Egyptian polytheism
Hittite polytheism
Mesopotamian polytheism
Arabian religion
Semite polytheism

I'm going to add a few details about the Hittite polytheism

Heavily influenced by Mesopotamian mythology, the religion of the Hittites and Luwians retains noticeable Indo-European elements, for example Tarhunt the god of thunder, and his conflict with the serpent Illuyanka.

Tarhunt has a son, Telepinu and a daughter, Inara. Inara is involved with the Puruli spring festival. She is a protective deity (dLAMMA). Ishara is a goddess of the oath.Kumarbi is the father of Tarhunt, his role in the Song of Kumarbi being reminiscent of that of Kronos in the Theogony of Hesiod. Ullikummi is a stone monster fathered by Kumarbi, reminiscent of Hesiod's Typhon.The Luwian god of weather and lightning Pihassassa may be at the origin of Greek Pegasus. Depictions of hybrid animals (like hippogriffs, chimerae etc.) are typical for the Anatolian art of the period.The Sun goddess of Arinna (Xanthos)
The Hittites often worshipped their gods through Huwasi stones. These stones represented deities and would be treated as a sacred object.

For the temples of the Hittites use Huwasi stones Details below

In Hittite religion, a huwasi stone is sacred to a deity and is usually situated in a temple. Larger huwasi stones were placed in an open area surrounded by trees and other plants. The stones were treated as gods; they were given food and water, anointed, and washed. At any cult center, the deities who couldn't be given a temple were worshipped at huwasi stones. The term huwasi was used to describe the housing of the sacred stela, the huwasi stone.

I'm going to help you make this mod not as Rome Total War which is completely fantastic but I'm going to make this historically right. Well if you design the mod why you don't design it right. If you want more I am free to write just ask me. I may get a bit late to reply but be sure that I will

I have a map about the Hittite Empire and their cities. Just tell me how I can upload it. As for the traits they are famous for their iro mining skills and they were perfect in making chariots.

[This message has been edited by George Maxentius (edited 06-17-2008 @ 04:41 PM).]

SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 17 June 2008 19:27 EDT (US)     79 / 253       
all good good, gives us lots to work with


does anyone have any details on the types of cavalry/chariots available to these cultures? so far i know that:


true cavalry was a late (late!) addition mostly for supporting the chariot charge (making sure that the enemy would not close and encircle). they were lightly armed and armored, using overhand spears. Iranian tribes are among the first in the region to employ true cavalry.

horse archers would begin awkwardly, in two-horse teams (one to shoot and one to hold both reigns), and only at the very close of our game would there begin to be competent single-man mounted archers. We probably cannot include these two-man teams, but we can try.

chariots is what i don't know about. I know that there were many variations in horse number, arrangement, cart size, cart shape, and armament. However, i do not know specifically what these were and who used which. I do know that egyptian chariots were faster, more maneuverable, and employed missiles, while hittite chariots were heavier and meant for crashing through the lines and assyrian late chariots were so powerful in the charge that they become the core of an army, followed by horses and the straggling auxiliar infantry. Also that no chariot was well-suited to the mountainous terrain of canaan or the deserts of arabia.

most horses of the time were small, meager, and slow, which would change as the centuries went on. Donkeys, however, seem to have fallen out of fashion as war-chariot pullers by the 18th dynasty, making their use in this game anachronistic.

we also need chariot runners - fast skirmish troops which would also help keep the enemy from closing too quickly around the chariots until line infantry arrives.

I'm going to try and see if we can't make chariots more difficult to use than vanilla - less maneuverable, etc. This may require that we look into - i hate to say it - terrain editing >.<.


New philistine badge, much cleaner and more "symbol" like



as for uploading the map, i like using xs.to or imageshack.us, but you can also email directly to caesar vincens as he needs it most.


also - i've been looking to other wargamers as inspiration (visual and rules).
check out these pages for "reasonably accurate" armies:
http://www.vinceshomepage.com/BeginPage.htm

[This message has been edited by SrJamesTyrrel (edited 06-18-2008 @ 00:47 AM).]

Leo IV
Legionary
(id: leonadas_IV)
posted 18 June 2008 00:48 EDT (US)     80 / 253       
Sorry i havnt posted in a while, cant post much now just saying im still in. now to go to sleep.

LEO IV
Pugna Concusio ~ Fight the Oppression
Army Commander
SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 18 June 2008 01:33 EDT (US)     81 / 253       
too late, we've finished without you. better luck next time.

kidding of course . thanks for checking in .

If you're in the mood for some bedtime stories, there's some great work being presented by our peers here.




also - why do we have historians? because I don't know jack!

neo-assyrians are out of the game, as they officially arise during the years after the game. While assyria seems to been unstable culturally and militarily, it seems that they remained under remarkably strong political leadership. the Neo-Assyrians I think should be replaced by the Elamites.

the babylonian throne appears to be an awkward one - shifting between assyrian and kessite rule as well as it's own independent kings. I think that simply "babylonians" may be the best way to represent these, but we're open to suggestions.

We may find that the Kessites should replace the babylonian faction, and that Babylon itself should simply be a powerful, restless city capable of training elite units for any of the three eastern kingdoms

[This message has been edited by SrJamesTyrrel (edited 06-18-2008 @ 01:45 AM).]

Ischenous
Legionary
posted 18 June 2008 11:43 EDT (US)     82 / 253       
Psst what about me, I want to help.

Calling all new people. USE THE SEARCH FUNCTION before asking a question. Thank you.
Alert the APOCOLYPSE is coming!!!!!!!

BOOOOOOOOOOOOOM(Itcame)
"TWH Guild Award (Best Duo/Trio) -Ischenous/IJ"- Tryhard. Why he chose that nomination, I don't know...
Ilmarinen
Legionary
(id: Cilibinarii)
posted 18 June 2008 12:31 EDT (US)     83 / 253       
Interesting I live in 'Judea' =]

Cilibinarii
My AOK Maps
SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 18 June 2008 12:46 EDT (US)     84 / 253       
sorry! I swear I think that I read every new post and then there's 3 that I've never seen >.<.


Ischenous - we are more than glad to have you .

Andalus - great! your first mission, should you chose to accept it, will be to chose a faction from the list (or propose one) and find ways of "embellishment." Like the custodians or the sicarii suggestions, what can we do to put a little spice in the pot? Did some mycenaeans really strip nude save for helmet, spear, and shield? Did the hittite chariots really carry jugs of hot ox blood to throw on the enemy, causing discoordination and terror? Finding out should be a fun assignment for you and really helpful to us .


Tasks are assigned on an "as-asked-for" basis for now, so you don't need to do more than you desire, but if you desire to do more, YOU MUST ASK TO BE ASSIGNED. We can afford for people to work as they please, or not, because there is so much to be done. Later coordination will be paramount, but for now I want people to have fun.


ROSTER (UPDATED!):

if you have any questions, would like to volunteer, or would like to be assigned a task, please post here.

SrJamesTyrell/Me - de facto team leader, visuals. tasks: exploring possibilities and skinning assyrians, mostly visual but also unit and building rosters. Oh, and organizing - when he gets to it.

Andalus - associate . tasks: pending

CaesarVincens - volunteered for coding. tasks: currently taking on all possible problems with ridiculous speed. maps, buildings, and anything else he likes. self-directed.

George Maxentius - volunteered for history. tasks: faction research. self-driected.

Ischenous - volunteered for 'flavor' coding. tasks: unassigned

LeoIV - volunteered for history. tasks: world/map research. self-driected.

pokejunkie11 - volunteered for code/factions. tasks: not assigned.

PrivateClark - volunteered for visuals. tasks: not assigned.

Yitzkshatriya- volunteered for history. tasks: not assigned.
CaesarVincens
Legionary
posted 18 June 2008 12:55 EDT (US)     85 / 253       
Right now I'm still waiting for more direction on the map. Since history is not my strong point, and biblical history certainly isn't I have no idea what cities exist and where they should go.

Veni, Vidi, well... you know.

Extended Cultures, A modification of RTW.

Si hoc legere posses, Latinam linguam scis.
ɪf ju kæn ɹid ðɪs, ju noʊ liŋgwɪstɪks.
SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 18 June 2008 13:04 EDT (US)     86 / 253       
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Ancient_citiesthere is a good list that will surely provide most of what we need, I'm busy right now but eventually someone can go through it and choose.

If you need a historian to sift through the data, would you prefer another task in the meantime? Aside from an assignment, you could enjoy a little break, or...well, you don't seem like the type to need micromanaging, so if there's something you think should be done that's in your powers, go for it .
Andalus
Legionary
posted 18 June 2008 13:13 EDT (US)     87 / 253       
What is the current faction list?

Is it as stated in the thread description, if not can you update it please?
George Maxentius
Legionary
posted 18 June 2008 13:21 EDT (US)     88 / 253       
Well I'm back and I'm available to sift the data just tell me from what thing you want. in the meantime I saw the work on the badges. I believe that the assyrian and the babylonian needs a change. Well the colors are your choice. Now the Assyrians use the god Ashur (image link to wikipedia:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Ashur_god.jpg
Now for the Babylonians see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Babylon_relief.jpgfor a better view. Still for the Philistines it is acceptable. For the Hittites why don't you add a more lion like head.

[This message has been edited by George Maxentius (edited 06-18-2008 @ 01:36 PM).]

SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 18 June 2008 13:59 EDT (US)     89 / 253       
Babylon can be made to be the lion, sure thing. And the purple can move more towards blue if they will use a different badge, i jut couldn't find another symbol and didn't want two factions sharing a badge and a color.

Assyria though I actually moved away from ashur intentionally because it's too much information to fit on a tiny badge - when you rescale, it just looks like a vaguely triangular patch of mush. I realize that the Assyrian Star is a twentieth-century adaptation of a Babylonian symbol, but in the same way that the hebrews probably used a menorah if any symbol, not the six-point star, the assyrian star and the star of david are simpler, universally recognized icons.

The hittite badge is based on how they carved lions, rather than how lions are, but i've long considered cropping and enlarging just the face for the same reasons that I chose the other symbols - readability. Give me a moment to try.

or

Thanks again for the input. Others may contribute as well - I have opinions but do not call the shots, and this is the first of many times people will want to do things differently. I'll encourage democracy in this and all cases .

There is a third option, too - finding another symbol that is both accurate, recognized and clear. The Lamassu Guardians are an easily recognized symbol from the time period that can be reduced in size nicely, but I doubt they were ever used to represent a nation.

[This message has been edited by SrJamesTyrrel (edited 06-18-2008 @ 02:24 PM).]

Ischenous
Legionary
posted 18 June 2008 14:48 EDT (US)     90 / 253       
If I am to do traits, I will need a few questions answered.

Since I know nothing of religion at the time, will certain temples to ___ give certain (realistic) effects? I will need to know which religions will do what if anything.

Which kind of origanal traits do you want to keep?

If you have played EB or similar mods, you will notice they have 'political' traits if you get me. What kind if any do you want? Will need direction here too.

Calling all new people. USE THE SEARCH FUNCTION before asking a question. Thank you.
Alert the APOCOLYPSE is coming!!!!!!!

BOOOOOOOOOOOOOM(Itcame)
"TWH Guild Award (Best Duo/Trio) -Ischenous/IJ"- Tryhard. Why he chose that nomination, I don't know...
George Maxentius
Legionary
posted 18 June 2008 15:45 EDT (US)     91 / 253       
Well I decided to start the beginning of the campaign of the Jewish tribe. Well they must surely appear as nomads like the ones in BI.i also decided to give the way of Exodus here and later write Bilical information about them. First is Ramses. Next is Succoth. Later is Etham and later Pi-hahiroth. Continues with Marah and later Elim. The way continues with an unknown station named Red Sea. Continues with the Wilderness of Sin and later Dophkah. Next Alush and Rephidim. The Exodus continues with Rephidim and later in the Desert of Sinai. Well man its damn too long. Let me get a break. Now I'm writing the details of the cities.

The place name Ramses (Hebrew: רַעְמְסֵ 05;, Tiberian: ɾəmses), sometimes Raamses or Ra'amses, occurs four times in the Tanakh: Genesis 47:11; Exodus 1:11 and Numbers 33:3,5. The Septuagint equates this name with the Egyptian name Ramessu, hellenizing it as Hramessê (Greek: ραμεσση, ʰramɛe), whence Latin Ramesses, whence traditional English.The location is synonymous with Goshen, the land where Joseph and his descendants settled. According to the biblical account, the Israelites departed from Ramses in their exodus from Egypt (Exodus 12:37).Archeologists have not yet pinpointed the time or place of both major cities in the Exodus namely Pithom and Raamses, and some dispute its historicity. The Biblical Raamses is acknowledged to almost certainly be Ramesses II's vast capital city of Pi-Ramesses, located today at the sites of Tell el-Dab´a and Qantir respectively, whereas the Biblical Pithom or Pi(r)-(A)tum, (literally domain or house of the god Atum) is possibly located at Tell er-Retaba--as Kenneth Kitchen argues--rather than Tell el-Maskhuta as some writers previously thought.[7] These two sites, at Qantir and Tell er-Retaba, are 15 to 17 miles (27 km) apart.

Sukkot was agricultural in origin. This is evident from the name "The Feast of Ingathering," from the ceremonies accompanying it, and from the season and occasion of its celebration: "At the end of the year when you gather in your labors out of the field" (Ex. 23:16); "after you have gathered in from your threshing-floor and from your winepress" (Deut. 16:13). It was a thanksgiving for the fruit harvest (compare Judges 9:27). And in what may explain the festival’s name, Isaiah reports that grape harvesters kept booths in their vineyards (Isa. 1:8). Coming as it did at the completion of the harvest, Sukkot was regarded as a general thanksgiving for the bounty of nature in the year that had passed.Sukkot became one of the most important feasts in Judaism, as indicated by its designation as “the Feast of the Lord” (Lev. 23:39; Judges 21:19) or simply “the Feast” (1 Kings 8:2, 65; 12:32; 2 Chron. 5:3; 7:8). Perhaps because of its wide attendance, Sukkot became the appropriate time for important state ceremonies. Moses instructed the children of Israel to gather for a reading of the Law during Sukkot every seventh year (Deut. 31:10-11). King Solomon dedicated the Temple in Jerusalem on Sukkot (1 Kings 8; 2 Chron. 7). And Sukkot was the first sacred occasion observed after the resumption of sacrifices in Jerusalem after the Babylonian captivity (Ezra 3:2-4).In the time of Nehemiah, after the Babylonian captivity, the Israelites celebrated Sukkot by making and dwelling in booths, a practice of which Nehemiah reports: “the Israelites had not done so from the days of Joshua” (Neh. 8:13-17). In a practice related to that of the Four Species, Nehemiah also reports that the Israelites found in the Law the commandment that they “go out to the mountains and bring leafy branches of olive trees, pine trees, myrtles, palms and [other] leafy trees to make booths” (Neh. 8:14-15). In Leviticus, God told Moses to command the people: “On the first day you shall take the product of hadar trees, branches of palm trees, boughs of leafy trees, and willows of the brook” (Lev. 23:40), and “You shall live in booths seven days; all citizens in Israel shall live in booths, in order that future generations may know that I made the Israelite people live in booths when I brought them out of the land of Egypt” (Lev. 23:42-43). Numbers, however, indicates that while in the wilderness, the Israelites dwelt in tents (Num. 11:10; 16:27). Some secular scholars consider Leviticus 23:39-43 (the commandments regarding booths and the four species) to be an insertion by a late redactor. (E.g., Richard Elliott Friedman. The Bible with Sources Revealed, 228-29. New York: HarperSanFrancisco, 2003.)Jeroboam son of Nebat, King of the northern Kingdom of Israel, whom Kings describes as practicing “his evil way” (1 Kings 13:33), celebrated a festival on the fifteenth day of the eighth month, one month after Sukkot, “in imitation of the festival in Judah” (1 Kings 12:32-33). “While Jeroboam was standing on the altar to present the offering, the man of God, at the command of the Lord, cried out against the altar” in disapproval (1 Kings 13:1).According to Zechariah (Zech. 14:16-19), Sukkot in the messianic era will become a universal festival, and all nations will make pilgrimages annually to Jerusalem to celebrate the feast there. (A modern interpretation of this resulted in a recent holiday celebrated in Jerusalem by non-Jews, "The Feast of Tabernacles".) Sukkot is here associated with the granting of rain, an idea further developed in later Jewish literature.Observance of Sukkot is detailed in Mishnah, Tosefta, Jerusalem Talmud, and Babylonian Talmud in tractate Sukkah, part of the order Moed (Festivals). (Mishnah Sukkah 1:1–5:8; Tosefta Sukkah 1:1–4:28; Jerusalem Talmud Sukkah 1a–; Babylonian Talmud Sukkah 2a–56b.)

Etham (Hebrew: אֵתָם was the second place at which the Israelites stopped during the Exodus. According to the Torah, Etham was on the edge of the wilderness (i.e. the edge of civilization). It has been suggested that Etham is another name for Khetam, or fortress, on the Shur or great wall of Egypt, which extended from the Mediterranean Sea to the Gulf of Suez. It may be close to the modern town of Ismaïlia.

Pi-hahiroth (Hebrew: פִּי הַחִירֹת was a place referred to in the Book of Exodus as the place where the Israelites encamped while awaiting an imminent attack by Pharaoh, prior to crossing the Red Sea.

Marah (Hebrew: מָרָה is one of the locations which the Torah identifies as having been travelled through by the Israelites, during the ExodusThe narrative concerning Marah in the Book of Exodus states that the Israelites had been wandering in the desert for three days without water; according to the narrative, Marah had water, but it was undrinkably bitter, hence the name, which means bitterness. In the text, when the Israelites reach Marah they complain about the undrinkability, so Moses complains to Yahweh, and Yahweh responds by showing Moses a certain piece of wood, which Moses then throws into the water, making it sweet and fit to drink. There is nothing necessarily miraculous about the sweetening of the water, since there is a type of barberry which grows in the desert and has the herbal property of sweetening brackish water. Biblical scholars see the narrative about Marah as having originated as an aetiological myth seeking to justify its name.The text goes on to state that in this location, a decree and a law were made by Yahweh for the Israelites, and that Yahweh tested them. However, according to textual scholars the narrative concerning the bitter water comes from the Jahwist account, while the mention of law and testing is actually part of the Elohist account; textual scholars view this as the Elohist version of the naming of Massah, since the triconsonantal root of the Hebrew word used for tested here (נסה is very similar to that for Massah (מסה, and the later explanation of Massah connects the name to the same root . The Talmud argues that the text is referring to three additional laws being added to the Noahide laws, namely that tribunals should be created, children should obey parents, and that the Sabbath should be observed. In the biblical text, Yahweh also states that he would not bring any diseases upon the Israelites if they obey Yahweh's decrees; biblical scholars regard this as a redactional addition, and appears to be an attempt to distract the reader from the implication in the previous verse that laws were given by Yahweh before Sinai was reached.

Elim (Hebrew: אֵילִם, ’êlim) was one of the places where the Israelites camped following their Exodus from Egypt. It is referenced in Exodus 15.27 and Numbers 33.9 as a place where "there were twelve wells of water, and seventy date palms," and that the Israelites "camped there near the water".From the information that can be gleaned from Exodus 15.23, 16.1 and Numbers 33.9-11, Elim is described as being between Marah and the Wilderness of Sin, near the eastern shore of the Red Sea. It was possibly south of the Israelites' crossing point, and west of the Sin Wilderness. Thus, Elim is generally thought to have been located in Wadi Gharandel, an oasis 100 km southeast of Suez.

The Red Sea station is an unverified station claimed to be near the Red Sea. It is stated in the Book of Exodus that the Israelites encamped at the Red Sea following their stay at Elim.

The wilderness of Sin is mentioned by the Bible as being one of the places that the Israelites wandered during their Exodus; the similarly named wilderness of Zin is also mentioned by the Bible as having been a location through which the Israelites travelled. The Bible identifies Kadesh-Barnea as having been located within the wilderness of Zin, and most scholars, as well as traditional sources, consequently identify this wilderness as being part of the Arabah; it is thus eminently possible that the wilderness of Sin and the wilderness of Zin are actually the same place.The biblical narrative states that on reaching the wilderness of Sin, the Israelites began to raise objections over the lack of food, as they had already consumed all the corn they had brought with them from Egypt. According to the account, Yahweh heard their murmurings, and so provided them with abundant manna and quail.Later they left the wilderness of Sin and complained about a lack of water while camping at Rephidim.

Dophkah (Hebrew: דָפְקָה means knocking. It is one of the places the Israelites camped at during their exodus from Egypt. It is probably somewhere on the eastern shore of the western arm of the Red Sea, somewhere in the Wady Feiran.

Alush (Hebrew: אָלוּשׁ was one of the places, the last before Rephidim, at which the Israelites rested on their way to Mount Sinai (Numbers 33:13, 14). It was probably situated on the shore of the Red Sea. It means a crowd of men. A particular event that occurred here was the story in the Exodus where water flowed from a rock.

Rephidim was one of the places (or "stations") visited by the Israelites during their exodus from Egypt.

The Israelites had come from the wilderness of Sin. At Rephidim, the Israelites found no water to drink, and in their distress they blamed Moses for their troubles, to the point where Moses feared that they would stone him (Exodus 17:4). God commanded Moses to strike a certain "rock in Horeb," which caused a stream to flow from it, thus providing ample water for all of the people.

Afterwards, the Amalekites attacked the Israelites while encamped at Rephidim, but were defeated (Exodus 17:8-16). They were the "first of the nations" to make war against Israel (Numbers 24:20).

Well I'm know trying to find some info about the Desert of Sinai. But you will have it in the next turn because I couldn't upload you all the Exodus. Well I think that was all and that you know have ready the first 10 turns. Finally I'm going to bed. See you tomorrow when I will have finished the Exodus.

[This message has been edited by George Maxentius (edited 06-18-2008 @ 03:47 PM).]

SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 18 June 2008 16:41 EDT (US)     92 / 253       
Current faction list - gray names are uncertain


Amalekites

Amorites


Assyrians - silver/iron with blue and red


Babylonians OR Kessites - either cerulean and gold OR bronze and violet.

Canaanites - White and Burgundy

Edomites


Egyptians - Gold on White (yeah i broke the rules, no metal on metal....but the vanilla black ankh was historically inaccurate and ugs).


Hittites - Olive and Terracotta with Silver (yeah, i broke the rules again, no colour on colour, but I wanted a badge that would be a little less kapowy).

GAWD!!

Greek Tribes (Mycenaean and Achaean together)


Israelites - Blue with White

Jebusites - may become rebels

Lycians

Midianites

Moabites

Neo-Hitties - will sport some sort of eagle and different colors.


Philistines - Red-orange and pearl/cream.

Phoenicians - White with Blue-Violet

Rebels and Independent Kingdoms

Sea-Peoples - White and Jade-Green

Trojans

...and a possible replacement for Jebusites, if there is a hugely important people that we've not got yet.







As far as traits, that's something that will require a lot of thought that I haven't had time for. Research presented suggests that at least the hittites were great at mining, so perhaps a "nose for metal" or something better worded would be good to include. Also the eastern factions were great at laying and breaking each other's sieges, so some sort of engineering talent (command attacking or defending walls) could be good.

All (or nearly all) hebrew leaders need to be given some sort of "divine providence" trait that gives increased command - making up for their relatively poor units.




More notes - Projectiles!

it would appear that, generally, the simple bow was favored by infantry throughout the region, with the composite used mostly by nobility (charioteers) and their men. common bowmen used simple bows for the ease of production and care, while two sources i found suggest that the pharaoh's personal foot guard used simple bows to demonstrate their strength and prowess with such a clumsey weapon.

Simple bows will have a slower projectile than composite bows, and less range, and composite bows should get perhaps not so much an increase in power as the benefit of the AP quality.

In general, bows will be limited to flat trajectory, because the arrow had not yet advanced to a point where gravity could bear it down with reliable killing force. Slings will see an increased range and the ability to fire indirectly. this also more accurately represents my own experiences with bow and sling, where it is very difficult to launch a sling stone flat (as it is incapable of generating lift), while an arrow's force is always best when it's forward momentum is greatest (i.e. before the angle of the trajectory hits 0)

The best way to do it is probably just to switch the arrow entry with the sling entry in descr_projectile_new, as this most accurately reflects the relationship. then we might just lower all ranges...

[This message has been edited by SrJamesTyrrel (edited 06-18-2008 @ 06:35 PM).]

CaesarVincens
Legionary
posted 18 June 2008 19:13 EDT (US)     93 / 253       
If one of our historians could go through that list and tell me the important cities that would be great. I'm not hurting for time right now, but I do have other projects I'm working on.

Veni, Vidi, well... you know.

Extended Cultures, A modification of RTW.

Si hoc legere posses, Latinam linguam scis.
ɪf ju kæn ɹid ðɪs, ju noʊ liŋgwɪstɪks.
Apophis150
Legionary
posted 18 June 2008 20:10 EDT (US)     94 / 253       
i will be more than willing to be a historian on this project and would love to help anyway possible, if you want to contact me online my email is storfarm@hotmail.com
PrivateClark
Legionary
posted 18 June 2008 21:21 EDT (US)     95 / 253       
wow, lots of progress, the first lion badge looks best i think, the other one looks a bit pixelated and the the way the first badge's lion sorta fades at the bottom looks really good. As for a task, i can do anything you need me to do in photoshop or i could do a short model or two in 3dsmax (don't have much time as i've got a summer job).
SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 18 June 2008 21:47 EDT (US)     96 / 253       
How would you like to build an assyrian four-man (four-horse!) chariot cart? .

big, square, wheels the size of itself, you know the drill...

http://strategicsimulations.net/catalog/images/SSCAE011.jpg

no scythes on any of these! you can just delete them unless you've got another use for an object that moves with the wheels. just infantry-squishing arrow-drawing giant-box-on-wheels action.


- just the cart, we should be set on the horses.

[This message has been edited by SrJamesTyrrel (edited 06-18-2008 @ 09:47 PM).]

George Maxentius
Legionary
posted 19 June 2008 02:53 EDT (US)     97 / 253       
Well i'm back again but know I saw the badges. Perfect work. Because you don't have much ideas about the Mycenaeans you can use the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:MaskAgamemnon.png.Well it may be a bit of hard vut you will have already completed the Mycenaean one. For the Assyrians see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Lammasu.jpg.The same in the Neo Assyrians but with different colour.
SrJamesTyrrel
Legionary
posted 19 June 2008 05:34 EDT (US)     98 / 253       
Phew, glad we got that one figured out.

Thanks for the ideas, too, I'll swing by the met after work today and try to get some good details of these lamassu guys. The five legs thing is really cool in 3d so we'll have to put them on some sort of gates, too .

Will also try to snap a few shots of cuneiform, other Mesopotamian relief, and egyptian new-kingdom artifacts. Also some wall-paintings and papyrus illustrations - I had the idea that it might actually be more fun to make a lot of the graphics in this style, rather than the 3d thumbnails, as the egyptian and near eastern canon of proportions were very similar. This could read better, or it could break continuity between unit card and battle model, so it's totally just a "thought." Even so the textures and patterns should be good inspiration.

Also a note - buildings and chariots. It appears for most cultures that chariots were built, owned, and maintained by an entire social sub-class of the "chariot elite." To represent this, chariots could almost definitely come from academy/estate type buildings, which would also figure into corruption and public order, being that they are centers of the upper class.
Andalus
Legionary
posted 19 June 2008 08:01 EDT (US)     99 / 253       
So if you want chariots, you have to cope with the corruption of the upper classes who provide them? Like it.


Right, I'll get down to 'embellishment.'

I've just discovered I have an Atlas/History of Bible Times on my shelf. I'll look through it and see if there's anything useful there.
Apophis150
Legionary
posted 19 June 2008 18:06 EDT (US)     100 / 253       
will we be writing a script for the philistines not to have overrun all of canaan before the israelits enter. (IE) I meen will we make the philistines only be able to conquer after the israelites conquer jericho for example
« Previous Page  1 2 3 4 ··· 5  Next Page »
You must be logged in to post messages.
Please login or register

Hop to:    

Total War Heaven | HeavenGames