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Empire: Total War (Archived-See Empire: Total War Heaven)

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Total War Heaven » Forums » Empire: Total War (Archived-See Empire: Total War Heaven) » So generals are going to be non-combat?
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Topic Subject:So generals are going to be non-combat?
Gaius Colinius
Seraph Emeritus
posted 24 December 2008 16:41 EDT (US)         
From reading the previews, one article specifically mentioned George Washington as having "an honour guard". To me this would indicate that generals will be present on the battlefield as actual units but that they will be ineffective in direct combat. To make up for this, they would need considerable leadership bonuses to compensate. After all, why else would you waste a unit spot on them if all they are good for is hiding behind your lines?

So what kind of leadership bonuses would you like to see them get? Morale is a given but I wonder if having a good general will affect things like fire rate and accuracy?
Your thoughts?

-Love Gaius
TWH Seraph, TWH Grand Zinquisitor & Crazy Gaius the Banstick Kid

Got news regarding Total War games that should be publicised? Then email m2twnews@heavengames.com. My blog.
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AuthorReplies:
Waffentraeger
Legionary
(id: Daelon)
posted 24 December 2008 16:48 EDT (US)     1 / 22       
Thoughts are:

The in-direct combat won't really be a problem. In the passed the generals were typically the stronger units on the battlefield, however giving little in the way of bonuses other than moral.

In ETW, a general will improve forming formations, improve rates of fires, better cannon accuracy, and over all moral.

The general will player a more important role in ETW than it will in other TW games.
Legion Of Hell
Centurion
posted 24 December 2008 17:21 EDT (US)     2 / 22       
I think they will be able to rally fleeing troops, but they can still get captured or worse get blown up by a stray howitzer.

But if one of your best generals is in the battle where your soldiers can see them then they will be able to many things which could shift a battle in your favour. For example they can fire three rounds in a minute, stand their ground while being pounded by six pounders or not rout when embroiled in brutal hand-to-hand combat with bayonets.

General Rawlinson- This is most unsatisfactory. Where are the Sherwood Foresters? Where are the East Lancashires on the right?

Brigadier-General Oxley- They are lying out in No Man's Land, sir. And most of them will never stand again.

Two high ranking British generals discussing the fortunes of two regiments after the disastrous attack at Aubers Ridge on the 9th May 1915.
sskrypteia
Legionary
posted 24 December 2008 19:13 EDT (US)     3 / 22       
this is kinda off topic, but kind of on topic. I'd like to see enemy generals act on their attributes and personalities etc. like if one is a coward he'll run and leave his army if things stop going his way. If he's just generally bad he'll send his soldiers to their dooms etc.

just a thought.

Merry christmas btw

Síleann do chara agus do namhaid nach bhfaighidh tú bás choíche. - Both your friend and your enemy think that you will never die.
Waffentraeger
Legionary
(id: Daelon)
posted 24 December 2008 19:23 EDT (US)     4 / 22       
Merry xmas to you too.

That would be a good idea though, some generals would be less confident than others, or some generals would be more gun ho. This could be represented in the gameplay through a number of ways, one way would easily be on how they set up their armies formation, how they move, and how they react to opponents.

[This message has been edited by Daelon (edited 12-24-2008 @ 07:23 PM).]

SpartanOfShadowz
Legionary
posted 24 December 2008 19:38 EDT (US)     5 / 22       
I open presents before britain!

thats off topic but I would also like to see maybe the generals just having a handgun and like completely one shot knocking guys off horses n stuff

The blood we spill today is just the beginning
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Empire Total War Heaven : March 3rd, 2009 US
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Waffentraeger
Legionary
(id: Daelon)
posted 24 December 2008 19:51 EDT (US)     6 / 22       
even though they never really did that... Or not of what I hear. Generals were usually upon hill tops to get a birds eye view of the battle, and also a relatively safe distance away from artillery.
SpartanOfShadowz
Legionary
posted 24 December 2008 20:55 EDT (US)     7 / 22       
if they were on a hill wearing clearly marked "Hey I am the general" outfits how come they werent just picked off by a 50 cal sniper?

The blood we spill today is just the beginning
Proud to be American/Polish/Irish/Welsh
Empire Total War Heaven : March 3rd, 2009 US
Call of Duty 4/Call of Duty WAW/Halo 3 Beta tester
No need to spell my name, just call me Ben!
Waffentraeger
Legionary
(id: Daelon)
posted 24 December 2008 21:02 EDT (US)     8 / 22       
Because the sniper didn't get through the picket line. How much hollywood have you been watching??!!

[This message has been edited by Daelon (edited 12-24-2008 @ 09:02 PM).]

jomas
Legionary
posted 24 December 2008 21:37 EDT (US)     9 / 22       
no problem for me
i usually keep my general out of combat anyways
if they die, my units have a massive chance of running on the spot due to my ruthless tatics and only the general keeps them in line
so it will be same old, same old in this situation
Kor
Busschof Happertesch
(id: Derfel Cadarn)
posted 25 December 2008 05:10 EDT (US)     10 / 22       
They may also be responsible for allowing special features, like digging trenches/preparing defences or enabling the player to attack at night. They already do the second of those since BI and the first would also make sense considering the way in which they highlighted such fieldworks in the previews.
even though they never really did that... Or not of what I hear. Generals were usually upon hill tops to get a birds eye view of the battle, and also a relatively safe distance away from artillery.
It's not always true, although that was obviously the best thing to do. However, William III was shot once, at the Boyne, and nearly killed in iirc the battle of St Dénis. Only his personal friend Ouwerkerk (who later commanded Dutch forces during the Spanish Succession War) saved him, by shooting the attacker in the face with a pistol. Other commanders often did the same. I read that Marlborough, for example, often advanced alongside his troops for a bit to get a better impression of the situation. Montcalm and Wolfe were both mortally wounded at the Plains of Abraham. No doubt there were more of these.

Kor | The Age of Chivalry is upon us!
Wellent ich gugk, so hindert mich / köstlicher ziere sinder,
Der ich e pflag, da für ich sich / Neur kelber, gaiss, böck, rinder,
Und knospot leut, swarz, hässeleich, / Vast rüssig gen dem winder;
Die geben müt als sackwein vich. / Vor angst slach ich mein kinder
Offt hin hinder.
Thrashmad
Legionary
posted 25 December 2008 05:28 EDT (US)     11 / 22       
Yes, the Swedish king Karl XII always lead the charge when he could. One popular story is that after a large battle, a servant found a bullet in the kings scarf. A few millimeters from the throat!

And merry Christmas to you all.

"The satisfaction in this game lies in to see 300 heavy armoured horsemen ride chock in an easy snowfall, while fire arrows criss-crosses the evening sky" - Swedish historian and permanent secretary of The Swedish Academy Peter Englund on Medieval 2: Total War (translated by Thrashmad)

"A game that contains both Carl Linnaeus and five different types of artillery projectiles are indisputable exceedingly detailed." - Peter Englund on Empire: Total War (translated by Thrashmad)
Gaius Colinius
Seraph Emeritus
posted 25 December 2008 08:54 EDT (US)     12 / 22       
Let me tell you, my general will be sitting safely behind my lines and at the first sign of trouble, they'll be out of there!
Of course, this is all dependent on them being so vital that you couldn't possibly do without them.

-Love Gaius
TWH Seraph, TWH Grand Zinquisitor & Crazy Gaius the Banstick Kid

Got news regarding Total War games that should be publicised? Then email m2twnews@heavengames.com. My blog.
Nelson was the typical Englishman: hot-headed, impetuous, unreliable, passionate, emotional & boisterous. Wellington was the typical Irishman: cold, reserved, calculating, unsentimental & ruthless" - George Bernard Shaw
Vote for McCain...he's not dead just yet! - HP Lovesauce

Waffentraeger
Legionary
(id: Daelon)
posted 25 December 2008 14:25 EDT (US)     13 / 22       
It wouldn't surprise me if they were that important.
Hussarknight
Seraph Emeritus
posted 26 December 2008 08:21 EDT (US)     14 / 22       
Since it's possible to engage in duel with generals on the campaign map they will need to be capable fighters. So I'm hoping that this is shown on the battlemap as well. They shouldn't be extremely powerful, but I hope that they can at least keep the enemy of them for a while if need be. I'm addicted to using my generals all the time in RTW so I'll have some trouble fighting battles without them the first few battles.

          Hussarknight
Waffentraeger
Legionary
(id: Daelon)
posted 26 December 2008 17:09 EDT (US)     15 / 22       
Are the duels automated? Or can you actually swing your sabre at your opponent?
Gallowglass
Legionary
posted 26 December 2008 17:11 EDT (US)     16 / 22       
They work like assassins in RTW and M2TW, with M2TW-style videos.

------m------m------
(o o)
(~)

Monkey beats bunny. Please put Monkey in your signature to prevent the rise of bunny.
m0n|<3yz r 2 pwn n00b
Waffentraeger
Legionary
(id: Daelon)
posted 26 December 2008 17:45 EDT (US)     17 / 22       
Awwww! That's still cool though. I watched the video some time back about how they are designing the duels, they look so sick!
dakn77
Legionary
posted 26 December 2008 21:53 EDT (US)     18 / 22       
I would think/hope that at least for computer-controlled generals, how they participate in combat will be determined by some sort of trait.
Ecthelion
Legionary
(id: p90pro)
posted 27 December 2008 03:18 EDT (US)     19 / 22       
Morale is a no-brainer.
I'd like to see some sort of "decisive" trait, or something or other, that makes your troops move faster.
Get their orders clearly, ya know?

Sir, I have not yet begun to defile myself.
Swallow my pride? No thank you, Im too full of myself.
I bring you nothing but love and a shopping bag full of sexual depravity.
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jomas
Legionary
posted 27 December 2008 13:15 EDT (US)     20 / 22       
i think the moral will be alot more complex eh?
because at the time most soldiers moral depended on how much they liked there general
some generals like alexander suvorov were greatly loved by his men, and would fight to the death with him
while other generals were hated, and would run at times were things got slightly rough.

i wonder if they will show that in game
el_bandito
Legionary
posted 29 December 2008 00:27 EDT (US)     21 / 22       
Wise generals lead the troops from behind. Learn from the Mongols.

Michael Jackson
Selifator
Legionary
posted 29 December 2008 01:30 EDT (US)     22 / 22       
I think that generals should, as they always do, give a moral boost but also make troops move faster or obey orders faster.
What a general mostly did was send out runners with orders, so with a general the whole battleplan can come together that much better.

You can't say that civilization don't advance, however, for in every war they kill you in a new way.

Chauvinism is not a particularly nice trait at the best of times but can be suicidal when the person your talking too can have you executed on a whim.

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