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Dark Ages: Roman Revival
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Total War Heaven » Forums » Dark Ages: Roman Revival » downgrading infantry not smart.
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Topic Subject:downgrading infantry not smart.
GundamMerc
Legionary
posted 10 January 2011 23:17 EDT (US)         
I have to ask why it should be that the larger cities (and thus the one that can actually afford to equip heavy infantry historically) suddenly get downgraded infantry but upgraded cavalry? That's like if people stopped using cars because planes go faster. Besides, if this is supposed to be a mod whose foundation is the possibility that the WRE can resurrect itself, why is heavy cav the only way to go, this being alternate history.

Perhaps it should be the building of, for lack of better terms, certain "temples" that allow you to build heavy cav or heavy infantry. Sorta like the sacred band for vanilla carthage.

"The only one here who could possibly help us is Edorix. Unfortunately, he is busy off killing Romans right now."- GundamMerc (an imagined quote)
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GeneralKickAss
Legionary
posted 11 January 2011 00:53 EDT (US)     1 / 9       
I have to ask, man, what are you talking about? If this is about the Franks, here's the reasoning behind: we wanted to simulate Frankia's transformation from an infantry power to a heavy cavalry power - as France was in later times. That is historically attested and the only simple way to do it - simple as in no excessive script writing or other complex coding issues which none of us want to do - was to tie parts of the roster to the settlement level. The larger it gets, the better cavalry and poorer infantry it can field. Since settlements become larger with the passing of time, that was the consensus, and the way we would do it.

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Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 11 January 2011 01:47 EDT (US)     2 / 9       
The Franks had a historical shift from infantry to cavalry, as GKA explained. So the ranks follow that shift here- but with the heavy cav gain/heavy infantry loss tied only to the larger cities, a clever player can conquer smaller cities where the good infantry are and keep them small.

The other factions we discussed do not follow that line much. The Norse, for example, get strong and stronger infantry. As will the Romans, and the Persians. Most other factions, to be honest, unless their histories suggest otherwise.

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GundamMerc
Legionary
posted 12 January 2011 23:41 EDT (US)     3 / 9       
Then I apologize. Although I still disagree with giving them weaker infantry, if it is just for the Franks that is much more reasonable. Although I would think that it would make more sense for the Franks to get their best infantry early, like the barbarian factions in vanilla RTW, but these aren't as good as the ones the other factions get later on. Meanwhile their cavalry gets progressively better, leading to cav heavy armies.

Again I apologize for my misunderstanding, as I am just trying to help (in my own, cynical, way... I guess).

"The only one here who could possibly help us is Edorix. Unfortunately, he is busy off killing Romans right now."- GundamMerc (an imagined quote)
GeneralKickAss
Legionary
posted 13 January 2011 03:23 EDT (US)     4 / 9       
The historical Franks, from my understanding, had such cavalry-oriented armies and military culture later that it would be - as the general consensus realized - better to deny players the strong infantry from early-game and grant them new units of heavy cav, because that's more or less what happened in history. You could say strong heavy infantry "died out" in Frankia, when the Franks no longer value that branch of their arsenal and began the cav focus - sort of like how tight-formation phalanxes gave way to flexible units of legionaries, or the longbow to firearms, or Windows to Mac (kidding).

I too apologize for getting straight to the point and not softening it up first.

"The difficulty is not so great to die for a friend, as to find a friend worth dying for." -Homer
"You see, this is what happens when you don't follow instructions, GKA..." -Edorix
Guild of the Skalds, Order of the Silver Quill, Apprentice Storyteller
Battle of Ilipa, 206BC - XI TWH Egil Skallagrimson Award

The word dyslexia was invented by Nazis to piss off kids with dyslexia.
Mythic_Commodore
Ministerialis
posted 15 January 2011 13:32 EDT (US)     5 / 9       
Although I would think that it would make more sense for the Franks to get their best infantry early, like the barbarian factions in vanilla RTW, but these aren't as good as the ones the other factions get later on. Meanwhile their cavalry gets progressively better, leading to cav heavy armies.
That's basically what we're doing with this system.

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Kilos of Thermon
Legionary
posted 27 January 2011 20:48 EDT (US)     6 / 9       
Unless I'm mistaken, I think that the last time infantry was a major force in the Frankish Army was Tours in 732 A.D. But I could be wrong.

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JudicatorAldaris
Legionary
posted 20 October 2011 19:33 EDT (US)     7 / 9       
Well, gee, from the late Roman Empire onwards, cavalry was the main force in battle.

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Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 21 October 2011 01:36 EDT (US)     8 / 9       
We figured that out nine months ago- at least for the Franks.

Infantry was always the bulk of any army- with the exception of the Parthians and Huns. Cavalry became more and more important- especially after the stirrup- but the only Western battle that comes to mind where an all-cavalry army defeated another army was Carrhae - and those were horse archers.

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Agrippa 271
Legionary
posted 22 November 2011 22:18 EDT (US)     9 / 9       
...Windows to Mac (kidding).
Better be.

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[This message has been edited by Agrippa 271 (edited 11-22-2011 @ 10:18 PM).]

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