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Topic Subject:The Visigoths
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Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 08 February 2011 10:39 EDT (US)         
We are a proud and vital people, the Visigoths!

We Goths sprang from the shores of the cold northern sea, and made our way south on the east side of the great forests. We traveled far, and in traveling, broke into two tribes- the Ostrogoths and we Visigoths. Life was grand, and we were expanding across a fertile land.

Then came the Huns, who drove all before them on their ugly little ponies and with fearsome bows in their hands. Like the other tribes, we too fled their onslaught. We went west, to Rome, in the hope that we could seek shelter behind their limes and walls. We had no gold, but we did have fighting men and courage. This we offered the Romans, who spurned us as defeated curs even as they let us within their realm.

Their magistrates were brutal, and their terms harsh. Again and again we were promised land and food and money for our fighting strength lent to their struggles, only to be spurned and ignored and robbed. Enough became enough, and a great leader rose among us. Alaric was his name, and he led us to march on Rome itself.

Never since Brennus eight hundred years before had that mighty city fallen to barbarian warriors. We were the first, and would do it twice to punish Roman perfidy. After that, we spat on the empire and decided to make Gaul and Hispana our home. The Franks- another Germanic tribe- joined us in Gaul. Both had fought the Romans, but both admired them as well. The Romans, once tamed of their arrogance, became our friends. We even fought the Huns together under Aetius- and drove those demonic horseman back into the far plains from which they sprang!

Then Rome fell from grace, though the descendants of the great Aetius managed to hold on to a little corner. The rest of the Empire went up for grabs in the West- and we Visigoths chose Hispana and Aquitaine as our homeland. Here we are, and here you found us to command.

Welcome to the Visigoths, the strongest of all!

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AuthorReplies:
Drakontos
Legionary
posted 23 February 2011 12:39 EDT (US)     51 / 81       
So let's open another discussion. This one will resolve itself somehow over the next week, so while we wait how about we add something more to talk about!

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eth689
Legionary
posted 23 February 2011 21:44 EDT (US)     52 / 81       
ive been gone for a while but i must say BI got the Goths really well. I hope we don't do too many changes
Drakontos
Legionary
posted 24 February 2011 03:15 EDT (US)     53 / 81       
Welcome back, eth!

What do you think of the warcry discussion in the posts above?

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GeneralKickAss
Legionary
posted 24 February 2011 04:46 EDT (US)     54 / 81       
We have done quite some changes, but as I see it, it's Change We Can Believe In.

Besides, it's a different story now, what with the OG/VG division, OG half-Romanizing, VG settling down in Spain and all. Still, we'd love to hear your ideas, now that you're back.

"The difficulty is not so great to die for a friend, as to find a friend worth dying for." -Homer
"You see, this is what happens when you don't follow instructions, GKA..." -Edorix
Guild of the Skalds, Order of the Silver Quill, Apprentice Storyteller
Battle of Ilipa, 206BC - XI TWH Egil Skallagrimson Award

The word dyslexia was invented by Nazis to piss off kids with dyslexia.
GeneralKickAss
Legionary
posted 25 February 2011 06:05 EDT (US)     55 / 81       
Summary

Faction Leader - Rex Visigothi
Faction Heir - Magna Ducis

Faction Symbol: Golden 4-T Cross on a Black Field.

Govt Building
Vigiles

Infantry
Gadrauhts (Levy Spearmen, warcry)
Gothic Spear Comitatus (warcry)
Gadrauhts Hairus (Swords Comitatus, warcry)
Gothic Axe Comitatus (warcry)
Dismounted Gothic Nobles

Missile
Skirmishers
Gothic Archers (Chosens)

Cavalry
Gothic Raiders - axe-wielding chase cav
Gothic Lancers
Equites Hispana - good-stamina medium jav cav, respectable melee
Gothic Nobles
Gothic Cavalry - one word: kick-ass
Warlord

Navy
Boats
Large Boats

Siege Weapons
Ballistae
Onagers

Mercenaries (see Merc thread)
Northwestern Spain: Asturian Foresters - kind of a Gallic Forester come-back
Eastern and Western Spain: Alan Armoured Horse Archers
Northern Spain: Cantabrian Mercenaries - stealthy "Illyrian Mercenaries"

AoR
Northwestern Spain: Suevic Spearmen (upon conquest)
Northeastern Spain: Basque Warband - hardy medium axemen

Special Buildings
Tier 4 Craftsmen's Guild more tradeable goods
Tier 5 Jewellers' Guild even more tradeable goods

Tier 5 Masons' Guild (30% off for stone buildings?)

"The difficulty is not so great to die for a friend, as to find a friend worth dying for." -Homer
"You see, this is what happens when you don't follow instructions, GKA..." -Edorix
Guild of the Skalds, Order of the Silver Quill, Apprentice Storyteller
Battle of Ilipa, 206BC - XI TWH Egil Skallagrimson Award

The word dyslexia was invented by Nazis to piss off kids with dyslexia.

[This message has been edited by GeneralKickAss (edited 02-25-2011 @ 07:00 AM).]

Drakontos
Legionary
posted 26 February 2011 16:33 EDT (US)     56 / 81       
Tier 5 Masons' Guild (30% off for stone buildings?)
Dunget howzit gunna work.

Otherwise very good.

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GeneralKickAss
Legionary
posted 26 February 2011 20:14 EDT (US)     57 / 81       
You can offer building cost discounts, but not specific building - that whutcha tryna say?

Well, I'm guessing that by the time a city reaches the Tier 5 milestone (Large City), most - if not all - of its buildings would have been stone-built already. So, it might work even if we don't specify stone buildings

"The difficulty is not so great to die for a friend, as to find a friend worth dying for." -Homer
"You see, this is what happens when you don't follow instructions, GKA..." -Edorix
Guild of the Skalds, Order of the Silver Quill, Apprentice Storyteller
Battle of Ilipa, 206BC - XI TWH Egil Skallagrimson Award

The word dyslexia was invented by Nazis to piss off kids with dyslexia.
GeneralKickAss
Legionary
posted 27 February 2011 10:22 EDT (US)     58 / 81       
Was just watching Gladiator for the umpteenth time just now, and came to the scene where Maximus told Lucius about the two famed stallions of Spain - Argento and Scarto - and thought we could introduce them as special retinue?

"The difficulty is not so great to die for a friend, as to find a friend worth dying for." -Homer
"You see, this is what happens when you don't follow instructions, GKA..." -Edorix
Guild of the Skalds, Order of the Silver Quill, Apprentice Storyteller
Battle of Ilipa, 206BC - XI TWH Egil Skallagrimson Award

The word dyslexia was invented by Nazis to piss off kids with dyslexia.
Drakontos
Legionary
posted 28 February 2011 04:38 EDT (US)     59 / 81       
Works for me. Name a character Maximus Decimus Meridius while we're at it.

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Drakontos
Legionary
posted 28 February 2011 04:43 EDT (US)     60 / 81       
Seriously. Let's do it.

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GeneralKickAss
Legionary
posted 28 February 2011 09:33 EDT (US)     61 / 81       
Haha, works for me too. These easter eggs should go down well with the community by pure awesomeness alone.

According to this site, Argento and Scarto translate for silver and trigger. I don't think they were actually famous Spanish steeds, but then again easter eggs aren't really about accuracy.

Maximus Decius Meridius - a famous Hispano-Roman legate-turned-gladiator whose name is known across the known world for his impossible triumphs and daring in the Colosseum. (accessible from the arena?) Btw perhaps we should give the first-level arena to the Visigoths, just for kicks? And the upper-tier Stable buildings could be usable for holding races - horse-racing and Spain were long-time friends anyway.

Argento - Maybe the best stallion of all Spain - which is indeed saying something - and the dream warhorse of every worthy commander. (+1 Influence, +2 to general's hitpoint)

Scarto - One of the two famous Spanish steeds. Whoever rides this legendary stallion into battle shall be invincible, and his warriors shall take heart from the fact. (+2 to army's morale)

Good good?

"The difficulty is not so great to die for a friend, as to find a friend worth dying for." -Homer
"You see, this is what happens when you don't follow instructions, GKA..." -Edorix
Guild of the Skalds, Order of the Silver Quill, Apprentice Storyteller
Battle of Ilipa, 206BC - XI TWH Egil Skallagrimson Award

The word dyslexia was invented by Nazis to piss off kids with dyslexia.
Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 28 February 2011 09:57 EDT (US)     62 / 81       
Silver was the name of the Lone Ranger's horse, while Roy Rogers rode Trigger.

It seems Gladiator had its share of Easter Eggs, too.

|||||||||||||||| A transplanted Viking, born a millennium too late. |||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Too many Awards to list in Signature, sorry lords...|||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Listed on my page for your convenience and envy.|||||||||||||||||
Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII
Drakontos
Legionary
posted 28 February 2011 10:25 EDT (US)     63 / 81       
I'd rather give the Ostrogoths the Arena. Perhaps some form of Arena-meets-Plaza de Toros building for the Visigoths could work though.

Maximus could be the rebel commander of Corduba.

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GeneralKickAss
Legionary
posted 01 March 2011 09:50 EDT (US)     64 / 81       
Maximus could spawn in the form of a rebel general, but then he'll eventually have to die

Instead, spawning as a retinue member through the presence of Arenas or just randomly in Baetica should help players avoid the horrible task of having to kill the Spaniard.
Perhaps some form of Arena-meets-Plaza de Toros building for the Visigoths could work though.
You know, bringing in the Plaza de Toros-ish Arena at 500AD is actually a pretty good idea. Bullfighting also allegedly has some of its roots in the Colosseum!
Bullfighting is often linked to Rome, where many human-versus-animal events were held. There are also theories that it was introduced into Hispania by the Emperor Claudius, as a substitute for gladiators, when he instituted a short-lived ban on gladiatorial combat.
Circlus Tauromachiae (Literally, Ring [of] Bullfights) could be a name for it.

In the light of this new development that just took place a few words ago, I am now of the opinion that the Arena shall be saved for the OGs - wallowers in Roman culture and ways. Lastly, the racecourse would be for true Roman factions only?

"The difficulty is not so great to die for a friend, as to find a friend worth dying for." -Homer
"You see, this is what happens when you don't follow instructions, GKA..." -Edorix
Guild of the Skalds, Order of the Silver Quill, Apprentice Storyteller
Battle of Ilipa, 206BC - XI TWH Egil Skallagrimson Award

The word dyslexia was invented by Nazis to piss off kids with dyslexia.

[This message has been edited by GeneralKickAss (edited 03-01-2011 @ 09:51 AM).]

Drakontos
Legionary
posted 01 March 2011 13:54 EDT (US)     65 / 81       
Yeah. Although the occasional ex-Roman city could have an arena or something still standing, for a bit of historical flavour.

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Alpha211
Legionary
posted 03 March 2011 14:20 EDT (US)     66 / 81       
I also think that it would be good to have Maximus as a retinue member with advantages rather than a rebel general to be tracked down & killed
Also the plaza-de-toros idea should work well with the visigoth spanish asettlements
Also I agree with Drakontos on the occasional arena (or something) in a large sized ex-roman settlement idea
Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 04 March 2011 01:33 EDT (US)     67 / 81       
Agreed.

|||||||||||||||| A transplanted Viking, born a millennium too late. |||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Too many Awards to list in Signature, sorry lords...|||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Listed on my page for your convenience and envy.|||||||||||||||||
Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII
GeneralKickAss
Legionary
posted 05 March 2011 05:27 EDT (US)     68 / 81       
Summary

Faction Leader - Rex Visigothi
Faction Heir - Magna Ducis

Faction Symbol: Golden 4-T Cross on a Black Field.

Govt Building
Vigiles

Infantry
Gadrauhts (Levy Spearmen, warcry)
Gothic Spear Comitatus (warcry)
Gadrauhts Hairus (Swords Comitatus, warcry)
Gothic Axe Comitatus (warcry)
Dismounted Gothic Nobles

Missile
Skirmishers
Gothic Archers (Chosens)

Cavalry
Gothic Raiders - axe-wielding chase cav
Gothic Lancers
Equites Hispana - good-stamina medium jav cav, respectable melee
Gothic Nobles
Gothic Cavalry - one word: kick-ass
Warlord

Navy
Boats
Large Boats

Siege Weapons
Ballistae
Onagers

Mercenaries (see Merc thread)
Northwestern Spain: Asturian Foresters - kind of a Gallic Forester come-back
Eastern and Western Spain: Alan Armoured Horse Archers
Northern Spain: Cantabrian Mercenaries - stealthy "Illyrian Mercenaries"

AoR
Northwestern Spain: Suevic Spearmen (upon conquest)
Northeastern Spain: Basque Warband - hardy medium axemen

Special Buildings
Tier 4 Craftsmen's Guild more tradeable goods
Tier 5 Jewellers' Guild even more tradeable goods

Tier 5 Masons' Guild (30% discount on all building costs)
Tier 5 Circlus Tauromachiae (+10% to happiness?)

Special Retinue
Maximus Decius Meridius - a famous Hispano-Roman legate-turned-gladiator whose name is known across the known world for his impossible triumphs and daring in the Colosseum. (+2 Command, -1 from unrest, +1 to the valour of your bodyguard)

Argento - Maybe the best stallion of all Spain. A warrior in his own right, and the dream warhorse of every worthy commander. (+1 Influence, +2 to general's hitpoint)

Scarto - One of the two famous Spanish steeds. Legend has it that whoever rides this legendary stallion into battle shall be invincible, a fact his warriors are sure to take heart from. (+1 to army's morale)

"The difficulty is not so great to die for a friend, as to find a friend worth dying for." -Homer
"You see, this is what happens when you don't follow instructions, GKA..." -Edorix
Guild of the Skalds, Order of the Silver Quill, Apprentice Storyteller
Battle of Ilipa, 206BC - XI TWH Egil Skallagrimson Award

The word dyslexia was invented by Nazis to piss off kids with dyslexia.
Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 05 March 2011 05:39 EDT (US)     69 / 81       
Many of these would be similar to the Ostrogoths, right? That should keep some unit slots open for more exotic things elsewhere.

|||||||||||||||| A transplanted Viking, born a millennium too late. |||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Too many Awards to list in Signature, sorry lords...|||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Listed on my page for your convenience and envy.|||||||||||||||||
Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII
Drakontos
Legionary
posted 05 March 2011 06:15 EDT (US)     70 / 81       
Yup. So we're done here, non?

Although Plaza de Toros should be two tiered. One a Minor City, one a large city (Ornate Circus). 5 and 10 happiness bonus respectively.

NEXT

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[This message has been edited by Drakontos (edited 03-05-2011 @ 06:20 AM).]

GeneralKickAss
Legionary
posted 05 March 2011 08:08 EDT (US)     71 / 81       
Many of these would be similar to the Ostrogoths, right? That should keep some unit slots open for more exotic things elsewhere.
Warcry! Not all units on both sides are uniform in their possession this ability.
Although Plaza de Toros should be two tiered. One a Minor City, one a large city (Ornate Circus). 5 and 10 happiness bonus respectively.
Non, for two reasons:

1. I cannot think of an apt enough name for another tier besides Circlus Tauromachiae that would not look even weirder.

2. This should be something for larger, wealthier, and hence more advanced cities to play with - something that was perhaps the foundation for the later Plaza de Toros. (that was the original idea of mine, anyway)

"The difficulty is not so great to die for a friend, as to find a friend worth dying for." -Homer
"You see, this is what happens when you don't follow instructions, GKA..." -Edorix
Guild of the Skalds, Order of the Silver Quill, Apprentice Storyteller
Battle of Ilipa, 206BC - XI TWH Egil Skallagrimson Award

The word dyslexia was invented by Nazis to piss off kids with dyslexia.
Drakontos
Legionary
posted 05 March 2011 08:16 EDT (US)     72 / 81       
Except the Plaza de Toros is something that just about every Spanish city has. And Spain isn't really hugely urbanised. Cities over here are quite small.

Ciclus Taurmachiae Ornatus or something. Literally, Ornate Bullring. Made of stone instead of wood, some Gothic Horseshoe arches if we actually make the model...

PROCRASTINATE NOT JAMAIS ARRIERE

[This message has been edited by Drakontos (edited 03-05-2011 @ 08:18 AM).]

GeneralKickAss
Legionary
posted 05 March 2011 09:28 EDT (US)     73 / 81       
Except the Plaza de Toros is something that just about every Spanish city has. And Spain isn't really hugely urbanised. Cities over here are quite small.
Remember that while it is certainly common in the 21st Century AD, our community mod is set in the 6th Century AD. I want to simulate the beginnings and dawning of a new culture, not bring all of it in, what, two decades?

"The difficulty is not so great to die for a friend, as to find a friend worth dying for." -Homer
"You see, this is what happens when you don't follow instructions, GKA..." -Edorix
Guild of the Skalds, Order of the Silver Quill, Apprentice Storyteller
Battle of Ilipa, 206BC - XI TWH Egil Skallagrimson Award

The word dyslexia was invented by Nazis to piss off kids with dyslexia.
Drakontos
Legionary
posted 05 March 2011 09:33 EDT (US)     74 / 81       
The stone arena of the Romans is available at the minor city level. Why would the derivative PdT only be available at a higher level, in a world in which the global economy is changing and cities are actually shrinking as trade decreases and the focus shifts to agriculture?

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GeneralKickAss
Legionary
posted 06 March 2011 09:52 EDT (US)     75 / 81       
The stone arena of the Romans is available at the minor city level.
I thought we agreed on Arena for the OGs? And I look at the Circlus Tauromachiae not as a derivative of the Arena, only as a Hispanian variant.
I'd rather give the Ostrogoths the Arena. Perhaps some form of Arena-meets-Plaza de Toros building for the Visigoths could work though.
Why would the derivative PdT only be available at a higher level, in a world in which the global economy is changing and cities are actually shrinking as trade decreases and the focus shifts to agriculture?
If it is as you say, that populations are less concentrated in urban areas but dispersing to the countryside, then how does that justify the availability of the bullrings in smaller settlements which might not really have the funds?

"The difficulty is not so great to die for a friend, as to find a friend worth dying for." -Homer
"You see, this is what happens when you don't follow instructions, GKA..." -Edorix
Guild of the Skalds, Order of the Silver Quill, Apprentice Storyteller
Battle of Ilipa, 206BC - XI TWH Egil Skallagrimson Award

The word dyslexia was invented by Nazis to piss off kids with dyslexia.
Drakontos
Legionary
posted 06 March 2011 10:11 EDT (US)     76 / 81       
I meant for other factions. The OGs do indeed get the Arena. The VGs no.

And because a bullring is essentially a series of wooden seats around a plaza, with a barrier or two thrown in. And also the bulls come from the countryside. Point is, a bullring is not all that complex. Not to mention that we're trying to restrict the number of Huge Cities, and thus also Large Cities to some extent!

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GeneralKickAss
Legionary
posted 09 March 2011 00:06 EDT (US)     77 / 81       
Then make one available at the Minor City Level, still called Circlus Tauromachiae.

"The difficulty is not so great to die for a friend, as to find a friend worth dying for." -Homer
"You see, this is what happens when you don't follow instructions, GKA..." -Edorix
Guild of the Skalds, Order of the Silver Quill, Apprentice Storyteller
Battle of Ilipa, 206BC - XI TWH Egil Skallagrimson Award

The word dyslexia was invented by Nazis to piss off kids with dyslexia.
Drakontos
Legionary
posted 09 March 2011 07:51 EDT (US)     78 / 81       
So, we're done with the Visigoths then?

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GeneralKickAss
Legionary
posted 09 March 2011 09:13 EDT (US)     79 / 81       
We are, unless a summary is desired?

Otherwise, DONE. *chop*

"The difficulty is not so great to die for a friend, as to find a friend worth dying for." -Homer
"You see, this is what happens when you don't follow instructions, GKA..." -Edorix
Guild of the Skalds, Order of the Silver Quill, Apprentice Storyteller
Battle of Ilipa, 206BC - XI TWH Egil Skallagrimson Award

The word dyslexia was invented by Nazis to piss off kids with dyslexia.
Drakontos
Legionary
posted 17 March 2011 11:10 EDT (US)     80 / 81       
NEW THREAD PLEASE O COLOURFUL ONES

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Terikel Grayhair
Imperator
(id: Terikel706)
posted 17 March 2011 11:27 EDT (US)     81 / 81       
Oh? Uh? Are we done here?

*yawns and stretches*

No need to shout. New thread coming soon.

|||||||||||||||| A transplanted Viking, born a millennium too late. |||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Too many Awards to list in Signature, sorry lords...|||||||||||||||||
|||||||||||||||| Listed on my page for your convenience and envy.|||||||||||||||||
Somewhere over the EXCO Rainbow
Master Skald, Order of the Silver Quill, Guild of the Skalds
Champion of the Sepia Joust- Joust I, II, IV, VI, VII, VIII
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